But they promised that all Palestinians would be able to return to their homes in the north at the start of their Genocide! Surely israel wouldn’t gasp lie!
It is not possible for a conservative to enter any conversation or negotiation in good faith. A conservative is biologically incapable of honesty. Every word uttered by a conservative is deception or manipulation. Every word.
Defund Israel. Let them answer to their neighbors on their own!
Just as they have the Hannibal Directive for captured soldiers and civilians, they have a similar directive with their nukes and are psychotic enough to follow through on it.
The +170 nations that voted for a ceasefire need to put together a task force to take control of their nukes & decommission them then run a truth commission with prosecutions & executions of the convicted.
The tunnels are forfiet, they are being systematically destroyed as they are discovered, and they must be, so that Gaza can be rebuilt without another century of Hamas violence.
If it’s just to move troops around, why dig trenches and have a huge no-man’s-land along the road? It’s kinda like they’re building Berlin wall v2. We’ll see if they’ll allow 1.5 million displaced Gaza populations to return to the northern part of Gaza later.
By what? By who? Hamas is the de facto leadership in Gaza. It was popularly elected, and then popularly canceled all future elections. More than half the world recognizes it as a terrorist organization. It will not have its own state. Not now, not ever.
Hamas has also proven that it does not care one iota about Palestinian people or it wouldn’t have built their tunnels under people’s houses, and it would surrender and end this bloodshed.
Maybe one day the US cancels elections, then I guess it would be okay to blow you, your parents, your children, and your dog into oblivion. You probably voted for this, so you deserve to die with no dignity under piles of rubble and pain.
Since 2007, Hamas has been the de facto administration in Gaza and has ruled with an iron fist. However, Israel has never relinquished its overall control of the territory, and the UN considers Gaza still occupied. Israeli forces, in coordination with Egypt, which signed a peace treaty with Israel in 1979, have kept Gaza enclosed by land, air and sea.
People, food, fuel, internet, power and water cannot leave or enter Gaza without permission from Israel. Egypt has a land crossing in the south, Rafah, but in practice, the military regime in Cairo – an enemy of Hamas and ally with Israel’s most powerful backer, the US – acts as an enforcer of the blockade.
Israel says the blockade is for its own security, citing repeated Hamas rocket attacks and incursions. But UN experts say the blockade, and intense bombing during five wars on Gaza, amounts to collective punishment on civilians, a war crime under international law.
I disagree with the conclusions of this pro Hamas nonsense. You have all the evidence right there.
Since 2007 Hamas rules Gaza with “an iron fist.”
Ya know stoning “infidels,” assassinating Palestinians who want peace, cancelling all future elections. Nobody is going to miss Hamas when it is killed to the man. It’s a far right Islamist terrorist group and part of the much large pan Islamist movement whose motto is “death to America and death to Israel.” The singular difference between Hamas and ISIS is that they disagree as to who should be in charge of the world, Iran, the Syrian caliphate, or a new caliphate in the Levant after they literally genocide all the Jews.
And don’t bring Egypt into this.
Egypt doesn’t want terrorists using its border to smuggle weapons and fighters, either.
Food goes through. The mass starvation everyone has been warning of for five months hasn’t happened. The daily death toll is dropping like a stone.
“UN experts”
may sound authoritative and conclusive to you but I went to school with some of these people and know how shitty they are with facts and reasoning when they get emotional, which is what Hamas counts on. They should surrender. Period.
There won’t be a lasting ceasefire until it stops fighting and by fighting I of course mean targeting Jewish civilians and using Gaza and everyone in it as its personal suit of armor.
All this shit you have to say about the evil Jewish empire is only to say that Israel must stop defending itself. That’s why for all your links you cannot give a rational explanation for Hamas’s plan on October 7 that didn’t end in a massive civilian death toll. 30,000 is awful but Hamas decided with the consent of Gaza to put every one of them in harms way and then rolled the dice with their lives.
If you stopped constantly dehumanizing palestinians for a second, maybe you’d recognize Hamas began due to the terrible material conditions of Occupation, and has the goal of ending the occupation. Maybe you’d even recognize collective punishment has been a deliberate Israeli tactic for decades with the Dahiya doctrine. Hamas is very different from ISIS, but they both were born out of Terrorism from Israel and the US respectively. Hamas wants an end to the Apartheid, not genocide. That claim is both untrue, and holds no weight when Israel is currently engaging in genocide. This is about the state of Israel being founded on ethnic cleansing and it’s most recent ethnic cleansing campaign. Not Jewish people, stop being antisemitic by thinking they’re the same.
Hamas in its early days, according to former Israeli officials, was seen by the government of Israel as a counterweight to the PLO. Israel supported Hamas as a way to break the PLO’s hold on the region. Retired official Avner Cohen, who worked in Gaza in the 1990s and oversaw religious affairs in the region, told the WSJ in 2009, “Hamas, to my great regret, is Israel’s creation."
In the 2006 election, Ismail Haniyeh led Hamas as the head of Hamas’ parliamentary bloc, while the president of the Palestinian Authority (PA), Mahmoud Abbas, led Fatah, as well as the PLO and Palestinian National Authority (PNA). (Haniyeh is now chairman of Hamas’ political bureau, and Abbas remains in his positions, as of this writing.) With Haniyeh at the helm, Hamas won around 44% of the votes across the region, according to a 2006 ABC News report, a total that secured a majority of seats in the legislature under election rules.
And in the backdrop of the 2006 election were geographic and political divides between Gaza and the West Bank. Contrary to what Bennett claimed, Israel restricted Palestinians from moving in and out of Gaza, as well as between the strip and the West Bank, since at least the 1990s, after the first Palestinian Intifada, or uprising, according to Al Jazeera. In addition to Gaza’s borders, the Israeli government controlled its coastline and airspace, allowing for military incursions into the territory, and, in 2007, established the blockade on goods and people that still exists as of this writing.
Pan-Islamism and Pan-Arabism were both movements born out of anti-colonialism and opposed western political involvement, but they are not the same and have different history. There is no monolith in the middle east. Neither a Muslim nor an Arab Monolith. If you think all Muslims or all Arab people think the same you’re just being racist.
Hamas, while associated with the Muslim Brotherhood in the past, is not the same as the Muslim Brotherhood.
When Israel occupied the Palestinian territories in 1967, the Muslim Brotherhood members there did not take active part in the resistance, preferring to focus on social-religious reform and on restoring Islamic values. This outlook changed in the early 1980s, and Islamic organizations became more involved in Palestinian politics. The driving force behind this transformation was Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, a Palestinian refugee from Al-Jura. Of humble origins and quadriplegic, he became one of the Muslim Brotherhood’s leaders in Gaza. His charisma and conviction brought him a loyal group of followers, upon whom he depended for everything from feeding him and transporting him to and from events to communicating his strategy to the public. In 1973, Yassin founded the social-religious charity Mujama al-Islamiya (“Islamic center”) in Gaza as an offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood.
The idea of Hamas began to take form on December 10, 1987, when several members of the Brotherhood convened the day after an incident in which an Israeli army truck crashed into a car at a Gaza checkpoint, killing four Palestinian day-workers, the impetus of the First Intifada. The group met at Yassin’s house to strategize on how to maximize the incident’s impact in spreading nationalist sentiments and sparking public demonstrations. A leaflet issued on December 14 calling for resistance is considered its first public intervention, though the name Hamas itself was not used until January 1988
To many Palestinians, Hamas represented a more authentic engagement with their national aspirations. This perception arose because Hamas offered an Islamic interpretation of the original goals of the secular PLO, focusing on armed struggle to liberate all of Palestine. This approach contrasted with the PLO’s eventual acceptance of territorial compromise, which involved settling for a smaller portion of Mandatory Palestine. Hamas’s formal establishment came a month after the PLO and other intifada leaders issued a 14-point declaration in January 1988 advocating for the coexistence of a Palestinian state alongside Israel.
Again with the link spam of things I already know.
I don’t think that all violent Islamist extremists are the same. I think they are substantially the same, not distinguishable in meaningful ways. As I said, the only difference is who gets to be the caliphate. For example, while ISIS and Hamas leadership are formally at war, Hamas just can’t stop getting its fighters to join ISIS, too.
Th really don’t though. You’re drawing your conclusions from the facts and I think your conclusions are shallow and poorly reasoned, and I think that you often cite to other people who draw the same conclusions as you because it makes you feel good.
We don’t have to agree it’s fine. I can still respect you. You’re disgusted by 30,000 deaths, mostly innocent civilians; you’re probably a very decent and justice-minded person, instincts that must serve you well. They are my instincts too, and serve me well.
I’m not interested in the chicken or the egg debate. though because it’s not relevant to the next hundred years. I’m interested in not having a hot war with Iran and not having the worlds dictatorships laughing while they wipe democracies off the map, which is what happens if Hamas gets its way. Start there.
Obviously Hamas is not going to get its way. Its outmatched in every sense except it’s martyrous zeal, and your instinct is what they count on as their only path to continued existence.
Again I ask, what did they think would be the result of October 7?
Advocating for a One-State or Two-State Solution is not “wiping a Democracy off the map,” it’s advocating for Palestinian people to have basic human and civil rights. If you think that Israel committing Apartheid or ethnic cleansing are ‘shallow and poorly reasoned conclusions’ then you haven’t taken a look at the facts. This has nothing to do with instincts, it has to do with media literacy. That’s why as a serious source to learn more about the conflict, I point to Ilan Pappe or Avi Shlaim or Nur Masalha. They are magnitudes more knowledgeable about the history of Israel-Palestine.
Hamas officials said shortly following the attack that it was a response to the Israeli occupation, blockade of the Gaza Strip, Israeli settler violence against Palestinians, restrictions on the movement of Palestinians, and imprisonment of thousands of Palestinians.
Mohammad Deif, the head of Hamas’s military wing, the Qassam Brigades, said in a recorded message on 7 October that it was in response to what he called the “desecration” of the Al-Aqsa Mosque, and Israel killing and wounding hundreds of Palestinians in 2023. He called on Palestinians and Arab Israelis to “expel the occupiers and demolish the walls”. Deif also called on “Muslims everywhere to launch an attack” against Israel and to urged supporters to “kill them [the enemy] wherever you may find them”. He continued, “in light of the continuing crimes against our people, in light of the orgy of occupation and its denial of international laws and resolutions, and in light of American and western [sic] support, we’ve decided to put an end to all this, so that the enemy understands that he can no longer revel without being held to account.”
The answers to this conflict are not in the history. I don’t care who came first, the chicken or the egg. Besides, if you dig deep enough, the oldest artifacts and recorded history in the entire region are Judiac.
Hamas is in charge of Gaza. The thing preventing Gaza from having what it needs is Hamas. They can’t follow zero international laws and norms whatsoever and expect to be treated like a legitimate state actor. They are not. Hamas is a terrorist organization and the present hostilities will not end until Hamas is gone. Hopefully they stop taking innocent people with them.
The answers? No, the context is. That context being setter colonialism, occupation, ethnic cleansing, and apartheid. This isn’t a chicken and egg scenario. No ancestral claim to any land justifies ethnic cleansing of the native population living on that land.
The ethnic cleansing of Palestine in 1947-49 was deliberate, the concept of Transfer is fundamental to zionism. It didn’t matter that the Palestinian leadership repeatedly advocated for a Unitary Binational State.
Gaza has been under occupation, Hamas has been internally governing Gaza since 2007, under the Blockade occupation of Israel. Hamas is a resistance movement that has done acts of terrorism, yes. That doesn’t change the fact that Hamas and other Armed resistance groups are the only ones fighting back against the Israeli occupation, a right which they have under international law. That doesn’t exempt them from war crimes, which is why you see Human Rights Orgs report on them when committed.
Resistance movements only get bigger as the oppression worsens, like it is now in both the West Bank and much more so in Gaza.
What do you know about what it’s like to live under Israeli occupation? If you don’t understand that, you’ll never understand why people choose to violently resist the occupation.
Gaza is not under occupation. Occupation is something that one country does to another. Gaza is not a country. Therefore Gaza is not occupied. See how that works?
Occupation is something that involves an opposing military force. Gaza doesn’t have an opposing military force. It has terrorists.
A military force respects international law and wears uniforms, it doesn’t actually and for-real target civilians indiscriminately with no pretext of military targeting.
Gaza isn’t a country and doesn’t have the rights of a country. Period. And it never will be, because of Hamas’s visionary leadership. They need to free the hostages and stop treating Gaza and everyone in it as one giant human shield. Where you’re from do you have any expressions such mess with the bull get the horns? Live by the sword die by the sword? Don’t start nothing won’t be nothing? Reap what you sow?
I understand why they resist and have a lot of sympathy with their perceived plight. And I supported a two-state solution until recently, when it became absolutely clear that Hamas will not evolve, and will not permit peace in Gaza as long as it remains. It is a far right authoritarian movement with no loyalty to the people of Gaza. The people there should have fought Hamas instead of Israel, maybe they wouldn’t be wallowing in rubble right now.
Ok dude, at this point you must be being intentionally obtuse. I don’t know if you’re in denial or you just like making up your own definitions, either way maybe you should try proving yourself wrong for a change.
Military occupation, also known as belligerent occupation or simply occupation, is the temporary military control by a ruling power over a territory that is outside of that power’s sovereign territory. The territory is then known as the occupied territory and the ruling power the occupant. Occupation is distinguished from annexation and colonialism by its intended temporary duration.
Straight from the wiki. The rules and definitions of Occupation have been very clearly laid out for a long time. And Israel has repeatedly violated international laws for a very long time.
Again, if you don’t understand the occupation, the setter colonialism, the apartheid. You will never understand the armed resistance against the Israeli occupation.
Seems like you’re not only confidently incorrect, but you also have no interest in learning a comprehensive history about the founding of Israel, the violent occupation, or a potential resolution. Because they are all intertwined. Hopefully I’m wrong, and you’ll choose to learn more. Here I have aggregated events that date back to the early 18th century all the way to present day, with multiple sources when I can. I only made that page as a jumping off point. If you are genuinely serious about learning the truth, you need to read the works of New Historians. Ideally multiple of them. I listed out the three I find the most comprehensive in my previous response. Ilan Pappe even has a few books on Audible so you can listen instead of read his works.
Bud I had my share of mid east history and world politics in college. I’m not going to redo the assigned reading, the post grad reading, or the extracurricular reading, because you think you know something that I don’t know already. Let’s assume I know the full history down to every detail you feel is important.
It still doesn’t in any way help to address the present conflict and the present belligerents. So it seems like there’s only one reason you’d bring it up and it very much has to do with who the belligerents are.and very little to do with what they’ve done, and it has nothing to do with interests in peace or humanity, if it’s not complete vanity.
I understand there are diabolically evil war criminals in the IDF and Israeli government just as there are in Hamas, and plenty of hate to go around for anyone that wants to join in. My country, too. One side gives them prizes with biblical zeal and conviction, fail not, and the other tries to keep the crimes quiet, or tries them in court and convicts them, some of the time, and has as its current political leadership a party that is very likely to be voted out of office, possibly very soon. Oh no, I can’t tell which one is worse, better pick the one that doesn’t make the news so sad. 🤡
Give me a break. The time for Gaza to stop living in the ninth century and be a world citizen has passed. Willfully targeting civilians is not a legitimate means of resistance. I can understand it’s motivation and understand that it is a criminal enterprise, incompatible with western concepts of representative government and civil rights, and in fact peoplemin Gaza who espouse such concepts get put to death as infidels by religious police. And yet you give Hamas a wholesale pass, not only all that, but also on using the entirety the population of Gaza as human shields and bargaining chips.
That’s the starting point. I don’t understand why you’re looking backwards from here? Definitely not interested in arguing about semantics. But if you keep reading your article beyong the literal first sentence, you’ll see I’m getting it from Article 43 of the Hague Convention.
Yet a multitude of international and human rights organizations have considered it occupation because Israel still controls Gaza through military force.
many prominent international institutions, organizations and bodies—including the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC), the United Nations Independent International Commission of Inquiry on the Occupied Palestinian Territory, UN General Assembly (UNGA), European Union (EU), African Union, International Criminal Court (ICC) (both Pre-Trial Chamber I and the Office of the Prosecutor), Amnesty International, and Human Rights Watch—as well as international legal experts and other organizations, argue that Israel has occupied Palestinian territories including Gaza since 1967.1 While they acknowledge that Israel no longer had the traditional marker of effective control after the disengagement—a military presence—they hold that with the help of technology, it has maintained the requisite control in other ways.
Specifically, experts from the UN Independent International Commission of Inquiry on the Occupied Palestinian Territory found “noting” positions held by the UN Security Council, UNGA, a 2014 declaration adopted by the Conference of High Contracting Parties to the Fourth Geneva Convention, the ICRC, and “positions of previous commissions of inquiry,” that Israel has “control exercised over, inter alia, [Gaza’s] airspace and territorial waters, land crossings at the borders, supply of civilian infrastructure, including water and electricity, and key governmental functions such as the management of the Palestinian population registry.” They also point to “other forms of force, such as military incursions and firing missiles.”
But I’ll assume you know more about the conflict than all of them. After all, you did mention that you read some history books. I’m sure they weren’t filled with revisionist history.
Okay we agree on that. You break it you buy it, as solid rationale as any. I think they not only pay but also have to administer the reconstruction, and that in addition to the work of rebuilding Gaza’s physical structures and infrastructure, Israel must rebuild the institutions of Gaza, free of Hamas corruption and Iranian influence.
Mainly geography. But also nobody else cares enough about Gaza to spend the time and money. The people that live there have no infrastructure or institutions in place to rebuild, let alone the materials and labor to do the work. Leaving Gaza to fix itself it not an option. Like where would Gaza even get the machinery or lumber if not from Israel?
Hamas’s international benefactors only give money if Hamas is fielding fighters and killing Jews. If Hamas is gone, Gaza is just another failed-state, thrid-world hell hole with no natural resources.
I’m not bursting this bubble for you right? Like where do you think this goes from here? Talking about, either a fully militarized border across which nothing travels and the famine everyone is concerned about comes to fruition and the death toll goes from 30,000 to 300,000, which nobody with any say in the matter wants, or Israel takes full control of Gaza for at least some period of time, maybe forever.
Right now Gaza is a warzone. When that is no longer true, it will at least remain under martial law while as the last pockets of Hamas resistance are rooted out and the last tunnels collapsed. It’s up to Hamas whether that takes one year or ten years. Hamas is in charge of Gaza and they do not follow any international laws or social norms. They will absolutely not be given a country to do whatever they please.
So because Israel destroyed it they get to pay to fix it, there can be an international coalition that can oversee the funds and the rebuilding.
Israel gets no fucking say at all about it.
Put up a 1km border zone encased on every side with fucking concrete and fill the whole son of a bitch with land mines with remote control machine guns with the only maintenance access on the Israeli side.
Kill anything inside, with solid walls there is no way for innocents to get in accidentally.
Ha. That’s amusing dystopian fiction maybe but not a real suggestion for peace, is it?
The whole reason they are fighting so viciously is because they can’t agree on the operating hours and zoning regulations of various piles of rocks, way out in the desert, where people go to talk to themselves after they get tired of talking to themselves at home, so they go on a bad vacation and talk to themselves near the actual piles of rocks from their favorite book series, and you want to bury any of the rocks in a kilometer of concrete? That sounds like an obstacle to the rocks and therefore an obstacle to the peace.
It’s not a rumor, that was their official announced plan, or rather small parts of north gaza. The conspiracy is that they want all of Gaza which they didn’t say, but is pushed by pro-hamas supporters.
I’ve only point out what the IDF had said was their plan. Some Orthodox zionist have been calling for all the territory of West bank and Gaza to be theirs, but they are a tiny minority.
Did you see the article? Something like half of the Prime Minister’s cabinet was at a rally celebrating that they’re doing this.
Here’s the thing: I can recognize that where people stand on this sort of thing is very hard to accurately gauge in the moment. It’s as likely that I’m overestimating the support for this plan as it is that you’re underestimating it
With that said, I have a strong motivation to rationalize that these people do not represent the center of public opinion. I really want that to be true. But as someone who has followed Israeli news and politics from before October 7th, and has been following it even more closely since, from the most on-the-ground sources I can find, I heard a phrase from a Lebanese Palestinian podcaster that has struck with me for months. He said,
“What we are witnessing is the Smotrich-ization of the Israeli public.”
That’s in reference to Israeli Finance minister and self-described fascist Bezalel Smotrich. I think it’s true. To my horror, the Israeli center and even left are far more amenable to the full ethnic cleansing of Israel-Palestine than any time in my lifetime. I could be wrong. But I think you should ask yourself what you think you should be doing if I’m not.
It’s as likely that I’m overestimating the support for this plan as it is that you’re underestimating it
Indeed. It’s hard to make a clear assumption on how Israel’s geopolitical agenda plays out, and your assumption maybe more correct than mine.
To my horror, the Israeli center and even left are far more amenable to the full ethnic cleansing of Israel-Palestine than any time in my lifetime.
The origin of the Palestinian - Israel conflict is of statehood and governmental control, not ethnicities. Arabs who have never called themselves Palestinians but have lived in the state of Israel since it’s founding have as much claim to the region as Palestinians themselves and are of the same ethnicity. In other words even if Israel remove all Palestinians from the regions they want, it will never be considered ethnic cleansing by the rest of the world, because Palestinians isn’t an ethnical identity, it’s a political identity.
I think the last part of what you said – about them not being an ethnicity – is unhelpful.
I don’t agree with the take, but I don’t want to get into a debate over semantics. I just want to try and get people thinking – from many different perspectives – about what is happening and what each of us need to do to stop it.
Millions of people are at risk of dying of deliberate starvation. Millions are being pushed off their land. The region is being destabilized, Jews and Muslims worldwide are facing increasing antisemitism due to a complex set of reasons, Israelis are facing a rapid erosion in civil liberties… and we need to say NO. We need to interrupt all of these.
We need to demand peace, we need to force from power leaders who pursue agendas designed to escalate conflicts because its in their interests, we need to halt the logistics operations that allow for people to be caged and starved and blown up and tortured…
I think you and I may disagree about a whole bunch of terms to apply, but I just want to find the common ground. Particularly among liberal zionists, because it’s breaking my heart to see so many liberal zionists freezing up at a moment of crisis and allowing the religious zionist movement to take charge. It doesn’t have to be that way, we all just need to find courage and act.
I’m not looking to cast blame or pick fights. As long as you and anyone else isn’t actively supporting population transfers or a single Jewish state displacing Palestinians from river to sea, I just want to find where we agree – stop the war, stop the march of global fascism in Israel, America, and every where else – and get to work.
Millions of people are at risk of dying of deliberate starvation. Millions are being pushed off their land. The region is being destabilized, Jews and Muslims worldwide are facing increasing antisemitism due to a complex set of reasons, Israelis are facing a rapid erosion in civil liberties… and we need to say NO. We need to interrupt all of these.
Indeed. I agree globally the world need to find a way to end this impending genocide of the Palestinian people.
We need to demand peace, we need to force from power leaders who pursue agendas designed to escalate conflicts because its in their interests, we need to halt the logistics operations that allow for people to be caged and starved and blown up and tortured…
The problem is for us to demand peace, we need to have a solution that most people would agree with, including the majority of Israel and Palestinians. What would that solution be at this point in the conflict?
First, I challenge the assumption that I have to provide a credible peace plan in order to demand an end to violence. The right-wing of the Zionist movement has made dismantling any infrastructure to work towards peace a key project, and they’ve been very successful. It was because of their deliberate actions that we have no good options, so I will not accept a lack of good options as a reason to delay. Those guys spent years fucking this situation up, and I demand they get to work unfucking it.
Second, I think the honest answer is that we design a peace process and we start on it, even if it’s a long one. Carl Sagan famously observed “To make an apple pie from scratch, first you must create the universe.” We don’t have a partner for peace? Well then get to work creating partners for peace. The Palestinians have been facing tightening restrictions for years intended to cut off the development of internal political thought and leaders. Stop doing that. Demand that they get the right to say and think and debate things that Israel doesn’t like. Build infrascturucture to make a peace plan possible and set a roadmap: first meeting this year, with goals to develop the boundaries of the first stage of the peace process, with an understanding that the first step is not going to be the creation of a new state or anything similar in scope. Increase the complexity of negotiations and their goals each year on a ten-year timeline toward imposing a plan meant to last for ten more years, with a plan to reassess after that period and decide whether to continue on the same plan or make major changes. Something like this.
We don’t have a partner for peace? Well then get to work creating partners for peace.
The US has been trying for years with the Saudi’s, Egyptians, etc… to support and encourage a peace treaty between the Palestinians and Israeli. And when the Saudi’s shifted, the Palestinians immediately went to Iran for support. Many other middle eastern countries nearby either hates the US, like Syria, or unable due to a crisis themselves, like Lebanon. So this policy isn’t possible.
First, I challenge the assumption that I have to provide a credible peace plan in order to demand an end to violence.
The reason for this war is because neither Hamas or Israeli wants to back down, and unfortunately thousands of Palestinians are caught in the cross-fire. At this point in the conflict, it doesn’t seem either Hamas or Israeli cares what happens to the civilians of Gaza, they just want to win this war. So unless you offer them a viable solution to peacefully end this conflict, they will not accept a cease fire.
I heard a reporter sometime ago about speaking to an Israeli that lived in one of the raided kibbutzes. He was part of the peace movement and he and some other guys in the kibbutz were taking turns bringing kids from Gaza to Israeli hospitals. And now he didn’t know how he had to feel anymore: several of his neighbors killed with their families, some kidnapped, …
Ongoing violence (from both sides) can only result in the ‘normies’ radicalising.
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