Ugh, I really hate when this topic comes up because it makes a lot of Democratic party supporters turn into gigantic assholes who attack everybody else’s character and say stupid shit, all of which makes it harder for me to want to hold my nose and vote for their crappy candidate (which, for what I know are obvious reasons to anyone on this page, is what I think everyone should do - but goddamn if some people don’t get me feeling Cabin in the Woods)
Republicans, who have already shown us their plans if they win, are unified behind Trump. That’s who they’re backing, they vote in droves, and put no further thought into it than cheering for their favorite sports team.
The other side, us, are splitting hairs, nitpicking, and generally letting perfect be the enemy of good at every turn.
All these accounts dredging up every article that fits their “Biden Bad” agenda (yes, agenda, based on post history) are not helping anything. They’re not suggesting any alternate candidate that can win. They’re not suggesting contacting elected representatives to support/oppose specific polices. They’re not doing anything other than spreading FUD.
Every time someone in the comments asks one of them to recommend a candidate that has a chance, they either go radio silent or move the goalposts.
The constant bombardment of “Biden Bad” posts (but adding “though I guess we should vote for him” in the fine print that no one reads) seem tone deaf at best and actively encouraging voter apathy at the worst. Whether the posters are actual trolls or misguided progressives is completely irrelevant.
And no, I’m not saying we can’t or shouldn’t criticize members of our side (that’s one of our defining characteristics versus the cult of the other side), but when it’s a constant drone of “vote uncommitted / third party” it’s hard to not see those as bad faith and working against the greater good.
Like it, understand it, or believe it or not, the reality of the situation is we have a two-party first past the post system, it’s pretty much already guaranteed to be Biden v Trump, and one of them has already laid out plans to be a dictator (cough not biden cough) . Those are our choices.
Pick a side or get out of the way. The opposition is unified, and we should be too.
The problem is this is going to keep happening every election and if the status quo is all Democrats have to offer apathy is going to set in sooner rather than later. Hell it already did with Hilary yet the DNC have learned nothing.
Democrats are rarely unified since it’s just a party made up of anyone who isn’t Republican. Green, progressive, moderate, socialist, etc. There’s only so long they’ll tolerate being ignored or seeing no progress.
Voters don’t want perfection. They just want someone who seems to have their best interests in mind and unfortunately a lot of ppl don’t see that in Biden let alone most politicians.
I’m voting for Biden but I’m tired of my vote being against Republicans instead of for someone I actually believe.
I can respect and agree with that. I’m also not asking anyone to start buying Biden merch or waving flags or anything like that; just asking people to see the bigger picture here.
Personally, I don’t think he’s been a bad president, all things considered. I voted for him last time expecting him to be a seat filler that wouldn’t make things worse, but he’s genuinely surprised me with what he’s been able to get done, especially with the current Congress.
Would I like to see someone more progressive at the helm? Absolutely. But that’s sadly not the world we live in right now or a choice we have at the moment.
I think you nailed it here. In many cases, it’s a direct attack on the morale of the citizenry, seeking to bury evidence of progress and emphasize a message of futility. No different from Russian propaganda that tries to convince Ukrainians not to fight, nothing is pure enough to be worth fighting for, they’ll just die for nothing, etc etc etc.
Hopelessness itself is the real enemy, the foundational source of strength of fascist authoritarians, what allows them to seize power regardless of incompetence. It can be attacked though. Directly.
Sometimes you just gotta slap a motherfucker. Sometimes rhetorically, rarely, actually physically. Either way, if you can break the feedback loop of hopelessness early, you give strength, courage and determination a chance to regain footing.
If fascists are going to be stopped, iron resolve is needed, as our forefathers showed. So maybe this time we don’t have to ourselves meet them, and their conscript armies, on the battlefield. As the Ukrainians are forced to.
It’s unfortunate, though. Unlike liberals or Marxists, fascists only really understand one language. And it’s not a civil one. Civil language is just a tool, to be harnessed in service of the only language they do actually acknowledge. Power.
Bad faith posts -> pointing out bad faith -> "OMG guys if you keep saying those things I'm not totally gonna vote for Biden anymore, you better stahp"
Yeah, sure, we're the assholes. BTW you can at any point answer the simple question I asked you about the narrative you were constructing about Biden's record, which you went radio silent on. If asking that type of thing about your statements makes me an asshole then call me Denis Leary I guess.
Productive actions to permanently improve real democracy in the US, things like supporting reform of the ridiculous FPTP voting system (or even like National Popular Vote Interstate Compact, which would be a much smaller step still in the right direction): Drake making disgusted body language
Throwing the November election to Trump: Drake with big grin
Productive actions to permanently improve real democracy in the US, things like supporting reform of the ridiculous FPTP voting system (or even like National Popular Vote Interstate Compact, which would be a much smaller step still in the right direction): Drake making disgusted body language
Yeah, its super frustrating how our lawmakers won’t do any of those things. I’m pretty sure all of my letters to them have been going straight into the trash unopened for a while now, so fuck if I know how to move this conversation in the right direction.
Glad that you asked what you can productively do! It's a wonderful question.
National Popular Vote Compact - Has lots of links and information about how to help. IDK how active this is; it seems like the effort has died down in the last few years, but in the time they were doing something they managed to get 205 of the 270 electoral votes they would need in order for it to take effect.
Ranked Choice Voting - This one is complementary to the above, and also has had some recent traction. It's on the ballot this year in Oregon and Nevada. In the 2022 election, it won in 8 of the 10 jurisdictions where it was on the ballot, including statewide in Nevada (this year's election is a required second proposition before it can actually take legal force). There's a "Get Involved" link in the header, the clicking of which will do more to change the democracy-situation in the United States than will posting discouraging messages on Lemmy.
Yep. I naively thought OP (and the similar accounts posting similar patterns) would shut up and get on board as we approach the general, but looks like they’re going to be banging the “tHiRd PaRTy” drum all the way to a Republican victory. And then all the things they’ve at least pretended to care so much about are going to get much, much worse.
There's another way to look at it: At least some of those similar accounts posting such a similar pattern of endlessly repeated postings with a particular transparent agenda are troll farms set to influence the election. Russia? GOP? Independent MAGA people with time on their hands? I have no idea.
But, regardless of all that: They're spending so much effort on it because your vote matters. You are worth influencing. There are people in Russia who get up every day and spend a full working day managing multiple social media accounts and just spewing a particular type of low-effort messaging in a particular direction onto US social media. Why do they do that, why is it worth it for someone to pay them to do that? Because what you think about American politics, and what you decide to do with your vote, absolutely matters in the aggregate.
Use the low-effort single-direction memery as a simple reminder of how important it is to vote in this election (as well as other actions; voting on its own isn't nearly enough.)
I watched the whole thing, and the vast majority of it, I agree with.
You keep assigning views to me (such as the liberal views this video is talking about) which I do not hold. I have no idea whether you're a Russian or a bot or anything like that, but I do suspect you of speaking from some sort of bad faith. Actually specifically, you dismissing what I'm saying by assigning me a viewpoint which is very different from my actual viewpoint, so that you can talk to me at length without addressing the things I am actually saying, is one big example of why.
I don’t care if every single person in the sub holds their nose and votes for Biden. I just want to remind everyone how much Biden is still a piece of crap conservative every day. That’s specifically what holding your nose to vote for Biden means.
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