Wouldn’t you thumb it against your palm so that your fingers are always aligned with the buttons, such is the case with laying your hand atop a regular mouse?
Well… I know there’s actually three ways to hold a traditional mouse, I saw a video about it once. Which was surprising to me, but mostly because I have big hands and I can only hold a mouse one way.
But for me when I’m holding a horizontal mouse the mouse is “grasped” by my hand as a whole, and I’d say my pinky and thumb are in a way holding the mouse.
With a vertical mouse it’s much the same where my whole hand is grasping. I’m not holding it any more with my thumb because the thumb rests on the body of the mouse. In fact as I think about it and type this out I think I have to hold a horizontal mouse more than a vertical, but again it might just be related to hand size.
I use both. Horizontal for gaming so I can have more than two thumb buttons. Vertical for work as it does give my wrist and forearm a “rest.”
Edit: realized I didn’t necessarily answer your question. For me with the vertical mouse the buttons are just there where they need to be. And I guess clicking is a form of holding…
The G502 has a thumbplatform, so that’s where my thumb goes. My pinky can’t touch the mouse cause my ring finger is in the way. But its slightly tilted, so its not exactly a horizontal mouse. Not nearly as vertical as this though. I just move it via the top of my palm. A vertical mouse seems like it would be uncomfortable in my right hand but fine with my left (maybe related to mixed handedness, maybe related to the different ways my wrists healed after breaking).
You just lay your hand on it. After a few minutes it settles as a natural resting position. And let me tell you, it’s sooooo much better than resting your hand on a traditional mouse. Best thing: these cheap vertical mice are not inherently worse than, say, a Logitech MX vertical. Just give it a try for 20 bucks.
Well random cheap mice could die after a while (happened to my brother), or need battery replacements often (happens to a colleague). Logi MX vertical has the benefit that you can charge it, and it lasts quite a long time before you need to recharge it.
Though honestly I’d never spend €100+ on a mouse. My company offered money to buy office things, I didn’t need anything so I took the mx vertical haha.
Just like a “normal” mouse you don’t hold it as much as you push it around. But we (at least, me and the people I’ve discussed this with) tend to actually “hold” normal mouses more because they are rarely very ergonomic and you can’t really move them in a satisfactory manner without gripping them at least a little.
Have you ever tried one of the MX masters? I used to have wrist problems but my master 3 just fits so well (the buttons are slightly angled, not as extremely as these vertical mice but like 20°) and its big enough to be able to comfortably rest my entire hand on it…
I briefly tried one, it’s probably my favorite Logitech mouse so far. I actually considered buying one when I had to change my mouse but I’m a sucker for those 12 buttons panels the razer nagas have
This makes sense. I LOVE my Logitech G502, but even though it seems “palmy” and my hands aren’t even that big, I end up claw-grabbing the thing really hard!
Yeah I had that one at work for a while and had the same problem ! Out of frustration I ended up trying out an ergonomic mouse just like in the OP that was lying around, and never came back
I had a chat about switching to a vertical mouse, with the Ergonomist (desk ergonomics guy) at my workplace. I short, he told me that if a regular mouse doesn’t cause issues, it’s not a good idea to switch. As your wrist and hand will have to adjust to different kinds of loads and movements which can start causing issues.
Yeah sure. Elecom Deft, I got mislead by a review. After getting it I searched some more, and apparently the ball is too soft and the point bearing can be replaced to be zirconium instead of ruby. But I suspect I’m just more sensitive to sticktion. From what I’ve read there are “ball transfer unit” that completely eliminate sticktion. They are a bit louder and not quite as smooth, but afaik there is no trackball using it.
So my guess is that people that use trackballs simply don’t really experience discomfort, and probably don’t really feel pain either :D So back to the mouse pit with me!
I have an Orbit Fusion for the couch. I looked at the Elecoms, but I just really like the scrollring. In my perfect world there'd be a god-damned three-button orbit with scrollring, but in the meantime remapping the Fusion's "Forward" button lets me use it with similar ergonomics. I notice the stiction, but it's a very minor little aspect of using the trackball, and it's not distracting enough for me to feel like I need to replace the bearings. I did do the "rub some nose oil on it" thing and that helped some.
There are a few DIY designs floating around that use BTUs, and some have certainly made their way into ergo keyboards, but I don't know of a commercial product that uses them.
Yeah I read this www.gbryant.co.uk/posts/…/post.html Once I have a 3D printer I’ll try building one. First without electronics to see if I like the haptic. Then I could add more buttons to that too or combine it with a 3D printed case for an ergo split keyboard.
I feel like any sticktion at all would be distracting me and ruining any chance to make very precise movements. So I don’t want to buy any more trackballs for now.
I think Elecoms are prone to sticktion. I have an Elecom Huge and I had to replace the bearings to make it smoother. None of my other trackballs have that much sticktion, my Kensington Slimblade in particular is buttery smooth.
Brand new trackballs can sometimes have some stick-slip. But they “wear in before they wear out” with use. Popping the ball out and cleaning it with warm soapy water and a rinse helps a lot. And whenever the ball feels sticky a wash is in order.
My current Logi tech ball mouse had a tiny defect in the ball that a minute’s worth of 1000 grit wet/dry sandpaper fixed. It’s now rolls like it’s running on air bearings.
If you suffer from wrist or elbow pain from using a regular mouse you’re best off doing strength exercises and proper stretching for those muscle groups. I find that to be more effective than using one of these vertical mice as your issue is likely from muscle overuse. Vertical mice can help but if you’re on your computer all day you’re bound to still have the same issue from overuse of your muscles.
That’s not how an RSI works. It’s not muscle issues at all, it’s the tendons that get inflamed from over use and that inflammation pushes against the tendon cords that bind them and that’s what causes the pain.
Years ago someone left my employer abruptly, and on their desk was left a fancy vertical mouse. It sat there for a few days, and I kept glancing over, at first ambivalent, but as time passed the temptation increased. I debated the dilemma of becoming a vertical mouse person, was that really for me? Eventually I succumbed and thought hey it’s worth a try, see what it’s like to be one of them… pure learning opportunity…
Then something happened… I got used to it in about a half hour and in the first day my precision improved. A sudden urge came over me to tell all my coworkers, was I really becoming one of those people so fast? Trying to resist was futile and within a couple days I became a vertical mouse person, always wanting to tell everyone how great they are, constantly resisting the urge. I forgot what life was like with a horizontal mouse, and I never looked back.
Anker makes a decent one, which can be bought for $20 or a bit less. Should be said it is the only vertical mouse I’ve used, but it works as a mouse and I haven’t had shoulder tension/aches since I started using it.
Honestly, I was, indeed, refering to that one. I dind’t know anker was doing one, but it is the same generic that many brands are selling. It’s optical and not laser, therefore precision is mediocre and the battery doesn’t last too long like the laser ones. Also the construction materials feel pretty bad. I mean, it’s what could you expect from a cheap mouse. But again, the normal mouses have much better mouses and with laser sensors for similar prices.
Yay! There are dozens of us! A cheap trackball is one of the best things I have ever bought. No pain, and it is really accurate.
I did have a regular mouse in my pc too so that other people could use my pc without complaining, but donated it to one of the new people at work. But happy, nice mouse makes the day better.
I requested a track ball at work, turns out, they had like 20 of them in some storage room that no one wanted to use. Shortly after I began using a track ball, others also wanted to try it out. Basically my entire department now uses trackballs at work lol
Trackball gang, how do you like trackballs for 3D CAD? Are there ones that can interpret three distinct axes of rotation or is everything just using two?
i find these WAY more painful to use than a normal mouse, it puts all my weight on that hemispherical bit in the wrist and the angle is just slightly off being the neutral position for my hand so it’s instead constantly putting stress on the arm…
i want one that’s just slightly more tilted than a normal mouse.
As an IT support person, the problem I have with these mice is that the left mouse button is also on the vertical. So when heavy-handed users click on a file in explorer, they also slightly drag down, so the file “disappears” into a folder, and now it’s a support ticket to get the file restored.
I was remembering just now I used to have one but I gave up on it almost immediately after using irl Thanks for reminding me why I quickly moved on from vertical mouse.
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