Mar-a-Lago Judge: Jury Sees Top Secret Files or Trump Wins

The MAGA-friendly federal judge who keeps siding with Donald Trump in his Mar-a-Lago classified records case has forced prosecutors to make a stark choice: allow jurors to see a huge trove of national secrets or let him go.

U.S. District Judge Aileen M. Cannon’sultimatum Monday night came as a surprise twist in what could have been a simple order; one merely asking federal prosecutors and Trump’s lawyers for proposed jury instructions at the upcoming trial.

But as she has done repeatedly, Cannon used this otherwise innocuous legal step as yet another way to swing the case wildly in favor of the man who appointed her while he was president.

Department of Justice Special Counsel Jack Smith must now choose whether to allow jurors at the upcoming criminal trial to peruse the many classified records found at the former president’s South Florida mansion or give jurors instructions that would effectively order them to acquit him.

cultsuperstar,

Can she really do that, force the jury without security clearance to view top secret documents? Seems bullshit to me.

But what are the options? Obviously she says to let Trump go if the jury can’t see the docs. If he gets the jury see the docs, do they have to get security clearance? They have to sign an NDA of some sort?

OldWoodFrame,

Hopefully they can appeal and just provide summaries or redacted documents. Or get security clearance for jurors, sure.

There has to be a way to convict someone for stealing state secrets without sharing those state secrets publicly.

If it’s illegal to share classified documents, including to jury members, and the jury can’t convict without seeing all the info on the classified documents, then it is just legal to share classified documents, you would be unable to prosecute. That would be crazy.

joel_feila,
@joel_feila@lemmy.world avatar

you would be unable to prosecute

I think that’s the point

Professorozone,

I know right? What circular reasoning this is. The government is concerned about keeping our secrets safe, so they ask for the former president to return them and must force the issue when he doesn’t, but to keep the secrets safe the judge wants them to divulge the secrets?

I do not see the relevance of the actual contents. It could have been a government encryption device or a cell phone or something.

As an alternative couldn’t they redact the crucial parts? Ex. “Submarine x, with a periscope depth of xxx is to be deployed in a xxx configuration to secure the xxx area.” Pretty easy to see the reason for the secrecy without giving the details. Although there are probably situations where this wouldn’t work.

charonn0,
@charonn0@startrek.website avatar

I can only hope that the DOJ is investigating her for corruption.

A_Random_Idiot,

deleted_by_author

    •
    EatATaco,

    Did she actually attend rallies in Trump face paint?

    A_Random_Idiot,

    I have deleted my prior post because I went back to find the picture and it has since been clarified that the one in the photo on the slate article was not, in fact, the judge.

    Apologies for the accidental misinformation.

    EatATaco,

    Good on you for doing the right thing and admitting your mistake. None of us is perfect.

    But can we appreciate for a second the fact that this post has 4 upvotes, but me questioning your “accidental misinformation” has been down voted?Lol. typical Lemmy.

    A_Random_Idiot, (edited )

    Just doing what needs to be done, nothing that should deserve praise.

    Personally I just ignore up/down votes. They are pointless gamification to manipulate human interaction in favor of dopamine triggers and addiction. I’ve tried to filter them with ublock origin so i cant even see the buttons or the numbers, but it just seems to remove them for that individual post.

    I’d suggest anyone especially ignore commentless downvotes, Cause you will always find random assholes that just get their shits and giggles from downvoting shit for no reason other than the fact it gives them some undeserved sense of power and control in their otherwise empty and pathetic lives.

    EatATaco,

    We’re basically agreeing, just saying it different ways: voting on these websites is a joke.

    A_Random_Idiot,

    Of course.

    Its not meant for any useful or good purpose. Its only there as an addiction driver to get people on that dopamine high. Which has resulted in human interaction on the internet (especially places that include up/down vote or similar mechanisms such as likes) becoming more and more extreme and polarized.

    knobbysideup,
    @knobbysideup@sh.itjust.works avatar

    This ignorance alone should get her removed from the case. Dear Lord. There are laws and rules for how classified information must be handled. Wtf?

    ryathal,

    There are also rules for evidence, which are generally the most important rulings in a criminal trial. Allowing the documents to be left out but also used as evidence is an obvious appeal that likely wins, secret evidence isn’t allowed.

    capital,

    How the fuck do you prosecute this case then? Read all the jury in just to see the evidence and then back out again?

    The jury needs to know if they’re classified. Why do they need to see the contents?

    villainy,

    This is what I’m asking. What do the contents of the documents have to do with the case at hand? How do the contents of these classified documents absolve him of the charges for making false statements and obstruction of justice?

    borari,
    @borari@sh.itjust.works avatar

    And if the jury really needs to know the contents of the files, I don’t see any issue with just swearing in a jury of already cleared TS SCI w/Poly Commissioned Officers, or just full send it and let Trump get prosecuted in a military court. I’d love to see a bunch of GWOT brass ream that dudes asshole.

    ryathal,

    The government doesn’t get to just claim things. If they want beyond all reasonable doubt that files were actually dangerous they have to show the files. They could try just going the expert testimony route, but that is a lot harder to prove. Another option would be getting Trump to agree the documents were classified, but that’s a dumb move to agree.

    Crashumbc,

    I’m pretty sure nothing in the law states that only “dangerous” classified stuff counts. The government absolutely has final say in what is classified.

    vaultdweller013,

    Yeah it could be the Navy’s secret ice cream recipe and it wouldnt change the consequences.

    hobbes_,

    Everything you just said was wrong

    noisefree,

    Lol, the documents are either marked classified or not - he’s not being prosecuted for having “dangerous” (whatever that means) files, he’s being prosecuted for possessing and improperly handling classified files and trying to hide evidence of this and refusing to turn them over when asked to do so.

    The core of the alleged crime deals with documents that are classified, not the contents of the classified documents, it does not matter why the documents were classified, only that they are classified. Whether the documents should be classified or where to mundane to be classified in the first place is not something for the jury to consider and not what the prosecution is about; any suggestions to the contrary are smoke and mirrors meant to muddy public discourse.

    All the jury needs to be able to verify about the documents possessed by Trump is whether they were marked classified or not, which is a matter of record and is generally denoted by the documents being marked as such.

    The judge is being absolutely unreasonable here and the only benefit of the doubt she can be granted is that maybe she just doesn’t understand the law (which would be pretty much just as bad).

    This AP timeline of the events leading up to the indictment is a neutral recounting of the facts surrounding the case that should help provide a better understanding, assuming you’re posting in good faith.

    reverendsteveii,

    Another option would be getting Trump to agree the documents were classified, but that’s a dumb move to agree.

    He already did, on tape

    “See as president I could have declassified it,” Trump says. “Now I can’t, you know, but this is still a secret.”

    www.cnn.com/2023/06/26/politics/…/index.html

    michaelmrose,

    Secret evidence is literally allowed all the time when dealing with secrets if the document in question is specs of nuclear weapons you redact all the strategically important info and allow them to see the header and subject matter without all the details.

    Natanael,

    He didn’t choose most of these documents because of their contents, just because they’re classified to satisfy his power trip, so all the jury needs to know is that they’re genuine government documents which are classified which he didn’t have the right to take.

    If this case had involved what he did with information in it then sure, but it ISN’T

    crusa187,

    Wasn’t this one of the main reasons for delaying the case to begin with? They had the “special examiner” review all the files to verify they were indeed top secret. I don’t understand why that person can’t just provide a summary to the jury. Letting them see the files seems like massive judicial overreach and probably illegal. Can she be disbarred for this?

    GroundedGator,

    Here are a few other good legal analysis for those who haven’t been following this shit show

    youtu.be/wR62ln4UfU0

    youtu.be/l4Fr6kIuzSY

    OneWomanCreamTeam,

    First summary I’ve seen that’s so digestible. Thanks for sharing!

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