LeFantome

@LeFantome@programming.dev

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LeFantome,

It is a good point. But given the importance of the decisions that get driven off these numbers, I think it is more important that they be meaningful.

In some ways, it makes it a more useful historical measure as well as you can have a greater confidence that the number reflects the pressure inflation was placing on people at the time.

LeFantome,

I assume your comment is about FreeBSD but Ubuntu 24.04 is Linux “software released a few weeks ago” and it did no better than CentOS Stream 9.

FreeBSD led on quite a few benchmarks. Quite interesting.

LeFantome, (edited )

What 32 bit distros have you tried? I would think most would still support Pentium as kernel support has not been removed.

AntiX and Q4OS are both decent choices.

For a machine that limited, I would probably give Damn Small Linux a shot:

www.damnsmalllinux.org

It is Debian based ( actually AntiX ) and so it has access to the full Debian universe ( 32 bit at least ) but has a curated list of applications well tailored to low-resource environments.

Some have said Debian is i686 only but this is what Debian says:

www.debian.org/ports/#:~:text=Debian supports all…,)%2C%20Cyrix%20and%20other%20manufacturers.&text=Port%20to%20the%20little%2Dendian,ISA%20and%20hardware%20floating%2Dpoint.

Edit: I take it back

www.debian.org/releases/…/ch-information.en.html#…

Debian, AntiX, DSL, MX, and Q4OS are all Debian based and so no longer support i586. What a shame.

Edit edit:

That said, this is a recent change ( Debian Bookworm ) and so Debian 11 ( Bullseye ) still supports Pentium. Debian 11.9 was just released in February.

LeFantome,

Could even be Cryix or a VIA or something from back then. VIA lacked cmov and will not boot i686.

LeFantome, (edited )

I thought so too but nope…

www.debian.org/releases/…/ch-information.en.html#…

That said, this is a recent change ( Debian Bookworm ) and so Debian 11 ( Bullseye ) still supports Pentium. Debian 11.9 was just released in February.

LeFantome,

Slackware says it still supports everything that the Linux kernel supports ( which would include Pentium ).

www.slackware.com/faq/do_faq.php?faq=general

Find it here:

linuxquestions.org/…/slackware-isos-and-torrents-…

LeFantome,

Have an upvote from me

LeFantome,

Antix 23.1 is based on Debian bookworm, so I think it requires i686 now. Older Antix releases ( based on Bullseye or earlier ) should work.

LeFantome,

They are really i686 though ( from Bookworm on ).

LeFantome,
LeFantome,

But bhyve is a hypervisor ( VMs ) and Bastille is jails. Neither of those is a solution for running OCI containers.

LeFantome,

You should give FreeBSD a shot sometime but it is probably not the best choice for a laptop honestly. If you do want to try it, maybe give one of the desktop FreeBSD distros like GhostBSD a try.

If you already like Debian, why not stick with that? If you want to try Mint, maybe Debian Edition ( LMDE ) would be a nice compromise.

LeFantome,

More up-to-date packages can be an advantage. One, they may have features you need. Two, there may be compatibility issues. This is especially true of dev tools and the graphics stack. The packages in Debian Stable are not that old yet but they will be.

LeFantome,

The other differences are leverage, tax sheltering, and the low cost of borrowing. How many people can borrow $1,500,000 at 5% to buy an index fund in a tax shielded account?

Also, don’t forget that you get to “invest” your rent money when you buy a home.

Real estate returns are higher.

LeFantome, (edited )

In Wayland, the compositor is the window server ( the equivalent of Xserver ). What you are looking for has to be a feature of the compositor and it is.

As others have said below, wlroots based compositors offer wlr-randr. There is also gnome-randr. For KDE, there is Kscreen-doctor. For X ( the window server being used by SDDM here ), there is xramdr.

Now, some people may see it as a problem that we have multiple Wayland implementations. I am mostly not fighting that battle. I will say that I hope these are not the same people that winge about systemd though and push for alternate init systems. I hope nobody that thinks MUSL is cool Is clinging to X11.

I would prefer that there was a common configuration standard for this stuff on Wayland. It will probably come eventually. Maybe as part of the freedesktop.org stuff.

Generally, I believe the Linux ecosystem has been stronger in areas where there has been competition between implementations ( even compilers ). I hope that Wayland will be one of those areas. As the core problems get fixed, the pace of innovation will increase. I believe we are already seeing that. There are more examples every day of things Wayland can do that X11 cannot. Let’s hope for more of that.

LeFantome,

You left a very gracious reply so let’s not fight.

I see a certain amount of irony in the overlap between the group of people ranting that Wayland has too many implementations and the group demanding more implementations of everything else. So that was my point.

Certainly we can agree though that there is nothing wrong with demanding more of both.

One my favourite new distros, Chimera, uses both Wayland and dinit (and Turnstile ).

I am interested to see where the diversity that Wayland provides goes actually. Have you seen this?

github.com/CuarzoSoftware/Louvre

LeFantome,

Say you have 8 apps that require 45 and you download one that requires 46. Now you have two environments. If the new one worked on 45, you could continue with one.

I am not advocating their position but that is what they are asking for.

It could be interesting if it stuck with the most recent that all apps support. So, if all the apps supported 45 or 46 then the system would use 46 but if one of the apps only supported 45 then it would hold the rest back to 45.

The idea with Flatpaks though is that they behave the same on all distros. So think it is better to force the right environment. It does make Flatpaks wasteful though which is one of the reasons I try to avoid them personally.

I use a distribution with lots of packages that are generally up-to-date so Flatpaks are not solving a problem for me. For most other distributions, they fill a real need. There are downsides though and this duplicated environments issue is one of them.

LeFantome, (edited )

To answer the question of “why not” we only have to ask “what problem are Flatpaks meant to solve”:

  • Flatpaks allow applications to run identically on different distributions
  • Flatpaks reduce the burden for software providers having to support multiple environments

The way that Flatpaks achieve these goals is precisely by mandating the environment that the application will execute within.

Allowing the application to run in different environments goes directly against two core value propositions of the project.

Being resource efficient is not one of the primary goals of Flatpak. Providing a consistent and deterministic execution context is.

There is your answer.

I am sympathetic to the question and the desire though. This is one of the reasons I do not like Flatpaks. Dragging in these big environments, and the duplication of resources, feels very wasteful to me. I would like them even less though if they did not even deliver on their core promises.

Personally, I prefer Distrobox to Flatpak. At least I have more control. Arch / AUR in a distrobox will let you install pretty much any app on any distro. If the app you need only runs in one distro ( like Ubuntu ), you can create a Distrobox of that too.

LeFantome,

I do worry about it. It is not just disk space but RAM as well to have these duplicated libraries. Often that is at a premium for me.

It is also a security problem.

It is also a pain to update. Most of my systems update with a single command.

Anyway, use Flatpaks if you like. If I used a distro with a limited package library or out of date apps, I would use it too.

The anti-AI sentiment in the free software communities is concerning. (lemmy.world)

Whenever AI is mentioned lots of people in the Linux space immediately react negatively. Creators like TheLinuxExperiment on YouTube always feel the need to add a disclaimer that “some people think AI is problematic” or something along those lines if an AI topic is discussed. I get that AI has many problems but at the same...

LeFantome,

Here we have a straight-shooter with upper management written all over him

LeFantome,

I install Red Hat 5.2 recently. Amazing blast from the past. The only web browser installed was Netscape!

By Fedora Core 1, it was all starting to seem surprisingly modern.

LeFantome,

I still fondly remember sitting in the Sun Lab at University downloading SLS disk by disk.

SLS 1.0.x still had Linux kernel 0.9x on it.

Just getting X at all on your own PC was like a magic trick.

LeFantome,

Uninstalled this recently as well. It is surprisingly slick for the time and way more modern feeling than you would expect.

Linux was just not corporate enough for it at the time.

In a different timeline….

LeFantome, (edited )

What do you mean 6.2 was the first version to put up ISO images for install? I installed 5.2 from ISO not long ago. I have installed 4.2 in the past.

I think it was 4.2 that came with the “awesome” window manager.

LeFantome,

I may be remembering wrong but I am sure I got CD images off FTP for earlier versions as well.

I have been downloading Linux since grabbing floppy images of SLS, used Red Hat for years, and do not remember having more than one version on actual CD that I did not burn myself ( for sure never DVD ).

LeFantome,

Congratulations on 2.0! It is looking really good.

LeFantome,

Ironically, they were probably afraid of the very explicit litigiousness of Nintendo.

Two solutions:

  • different names ( like Sony )
  • different positions ( like Microsoft )

Third solution:

  • get sued by Nintendo

Maybe they did some early testing and got feedback that people liked the button names being the same as Nintendo. Or maybe they read criticism about Sony using different names.

Maybe they were originally the same and then the legal dept depended a swap too late to change the actual names.

Maybe none of this stuff.

As you can see, I find the legal system to be a bigger threat and generally more frustrating than Microsoft.

LeFantome,

Not wanting to elect dictators is anti-democracy!

Basically the same logic

LeFantome,

There has been lots of reporting the X Elite will use UEFI.

LeFantome,

There has been lots of reporting the X Elite will use UEFI.

LeFantome,

There has been lots of reporting the X Elite will use UEFI.

LeFantome,

Dealing with legacy software is a huge problem for Windows. I feel like it is a much smaller problem for Linux.

Gamers will certainly be hit. But a lot of the workload in games is the GPU of course, which can be native.

What other ARM software are you thinking of?

LeFantome,

Thanks for this. I use Distrobox a lot and did not know this.

LeFantome,

Why boot and swap? Even /root is probably unnecessary.

LeFantome, (edited )

We are not the US in 2008. At that point, half the market was new buyers that could only afford the ARM rates they were given ( maybe even interest only ). When home values became less than the mortgage, they just walked away. The system often allowed them to walk away without losing other assets.

In Canada, the majority of mortgage holders have mortgages far smaller than their home value. They are not going to causally walk away from these assets. Look what you are saying about lower prices being “good” for you. It does not sound like you are going to panic and sell your home in a down market. Mortgage holders also had to qualify at rates higher than they borrowed. Not as high as they are now but the new rates will not be so wildly beyond their means as happened in the US. Mortgages that are close to home value are likely insured.

Finally, rates are coming down. While higher rates will certainly apply downward pressure, the rate reductions help close the gap and also send a signal that rates will be lower in the near future ( not as low as they were ). We will probably see a lot of variable rates with expectations of sticking it out for a year or two while rates drop. If prices do come down, some people will value hunt, making bets that declining rates will drive prices up again in the future.

Once more, I think some downward pressure is likely. I do not expect anything even close to 2008.

LeFantome,

This comment is bizarre to me. Is 35 mph fast or slow? Because it is the same as 55 kph ( km/h ).

55 km/h is an odd speed though it is true. Most towns in Canada for example, the default speed limit is 50 km/h. Highway speeds are more like 100 km/h.

Speeds in mph seem more intuitive to you?

LeFantome,

SAMBA? Did you mean Azure blob storage?

LeFantome,

It is for running on Azure and is the base under WSL.

LeFantome,

It does use systemd. It uses SELinux and dnf as well. It seems to be patterned in Fedora or CentOS Stream. There is no desktop environment.

LeFantome,

The command-line is not just faster, it is also much more universal.

You and I may use different distros and different desktop environments. If you want to create instructions that tell us how to do something using the GUI, there is an excellent chance you need different instructions for each of us. If you instead give us CLI instructions, there is an excellent chance that the same instructions will work for both of us.

LeFantome,

Actually that is a common misconception by people who have read political blogs from the 90’s.

The OS that you are calling GNU/Linux is usually less than 2% GNU these days as the GNU Project is only responsible for about a hundred packages. Most Linux distros have between 3,000 and 80,000 packages depending on the distribution.

In fact, if we are talking about software licenses, calling it MIT/Linux would be more appropriate. If we are talking about attribution, Red Hat contributes more code than anybody so perhaps Red Hat/Linux is more up-to-date. That may cause confusion with Red Hat Enterprise Linux though so perhaps IBM/Linux is the best term to use as IBM owns Red Hat these days and is therefore the top contributor to most Linux distros.

Of course, most people just call it Linux because everything above is ridiculous ( including GNU / Linux ).

All that said, teaching people about the FSF, copyleft, and Free Software more generally is super important. The GNU Project itself is more of a historical artifact at this point ( in my view ) but there is no denying its extreme historical importance. It would be great if people knew more about it. Much like BSD.

Teaching people to say GNU / Linux is not only not important but is downright political and factually incorrect. Not a fan.

LeFantome,

This is exactly what people mean when they say GNU/Linux. They are trying to say that it is “the GNU Operating Syatem” with the Linux kernel.

This nonesense though. Please ignore them.

Linux Mint is an operating system. It uses the Linux kernel. The fact that it includes a handful of GNU packages in no way justifies co-opting the branding. Linux Mint includes A LOT of software from many sources. Are you going to try to list them all in the name?

LeFantome,

I re-wrote my Tesla firmware in Rust. It is faster and more secure. Self-driving is no problem when you use a safe language.

Honestly, why are we even selling cars to people who do not take these basic steps?

LeFantome,

The creator here buys hardware designed to run Linux ( from Tuxedo ) and uses the distro designed to run on that hardware. So no big surprise he thought all hardware problems were solved.

Probably a similar issue with office apps. He is not trying to share an Outlook calendars with coworkers or deal with complex spreadsheets sent from colleagues. He is probably not sending many PowerPoints to his boss.

Good on him for reaching out to his community to ensure his opinions are backed by evidence.

My friend didn't have a great experience with Linux

I have been daily driving Linux for over two years now and I have switched distros many times. So, when my friend bought a new laptop, I convinced him to install Linux Mint on it. I asked him if he wanted to dual boot, he said no because it would fill up all his storage. We installed Linux Mint. The other day, he wanted to play...

LeFantome,

Ok Boomer.

Mint is literally the youngest distro on your list. OpenSUSE, Ubuntu, Fedora, and certainly Debian were all around for years when the very first release of Mint came out. With so many new distros to choose from, how did you manage to list only the old ones. Forgot the /s?

Mint is actually based on Ubuntu which is itself based on Debian.

Debian was a teen-ager when Mint was born. If Debian was a person, kids would be calling it a Boomer.

Funny stuff.

LeFantome,

First you say they are right and then you provide evidence to contradict them?

He says Mint is for Boomers so use OpenSuse or Fedora. You agree with him by saying that “old people” are happy with OpenSuse and Fedora.

Did you think he was saying Mint was for Boomers and the other distros were for people older than that? I mean, you might be right. So what do the young people run? Garuda? Nobara? Bazzite?

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