I mean, I wouldn’t mind the current President exercising this power over their political rivals, in the election, the House, the Senate, the Supreme Court, purely as a defensive measure to protect America. It sets a shitty precedence, but do we really want He Who Shall Not Be Named to set the precedence first?
“It sets a shitty precedence…” is a gross minimalization to attach to effectively making the US be a dictatorship. And saying you’re ok with a dictatorship because you happen to agree with the dictator is the kind of sentiment that cannot be left unchallenged/unexamined
So, in 4 years, will the next dictator be just as “good”? What about the next?
Also the whole “To save America” is literally the exact same reasoning used, and even believed, by the other side. It’s circular at this point, one is better, but the other thinks THEY need to save America just as much.
any post saying that The President can assassinate anyone or any party opponent is nonsense. They won’t do it themselves and if they order it, considering it’s illegal the military won’t carry it out. We have safeguards in place. The left needs to simmer down.
To do a “well, actually” I guess we didn’t really have an empire until well past the country’s founding. We were a mostly irrelevant backwater for some period of time.
ETA: And as someone who freaking loves this country, I realize that saying a comment like the above is one that could probably get you into a fight two days from now, most especially, when all kinds of fetishistic performative military nonsense and uncritical screeds about this country are at peak ridiculousness (and I love July 4th in spite of these flaws). I consider myself a real patriot, but one that is unwilling to whitewash this country.
No, the US has been an empire from the start. Unless you don’t count conquering and colonizing the indigenous peoples because they aren’t “civilized” or something.
All this murder crap is lame; why has nobody been parroting how the president can do other crimes, like tax fraud or lie under oath or buying drugs or literally anything but murder?
Because the point is to scare you. “Breaking news president buys crack” is not as scary as “Breaking news president axe murders cabinet.”
The ruling is not good, but it’s not Seal Team Six executes its political rival bad. It’s more likely to be President sells nuke secrets to Saudi Arabia under the new official “I Get to Sell Nuclear Secrets to Saudi Arabia Act” he just made up right now.
The President can fire employees that refuse to have sex with him. Firing executive branch employees is well within the President’s power. If they don’t submit to him, he can fire them. Official act.
Lame like an overbeaten dead horse, I mean. I was just trying to put out there that there’s worse ways to try and ruin our country like Madoff did but worse. And plenty of others I didn’t even mention.
The president can also now legally dissolve the Supreme Court and instate a new supreme Court who can then make the decision if it was an official act or not.
As I mentioned on another comment, there is no mechanism for the court to enforce that. The DOJ is under the President. Who will arrest the President? The SC may think this empowers them more, but it really does not.
I really don’t understand how people are twisting this so dramatically. The president is still bound by the law of the constitution. No president can just go on a killing spree. They still need to operate in an official capacity as POTUS. I mean, I understand we don’t want to give Trump a win under any circumstances but he most certainly can still be held accountable for his actions.
presidents are entitled to “absolute immunity” from criminal prosecution for official acts,
This is simply not true. There are three levels of actions: core actions defined by the constitution, other official actions as president, and acts outside of being president. It’s the first “core” actions that are immune simply because they are defined in the constitution - pardons, appointments, etc. It’s like saying putting on your turn signal to make a turn is immune from prosecution. Other actions as president are presumed to be immune but that does not mean they are “absolutely” immune from prosecution.
Presidents are now entitled to “absolute” immunity, which means that no matter what they do, the immunity cannot be lost. They are always and forever immune, no matter what evidence is brought to bear.
When he uses his official powers in any way, under the majority’s reasoning, he now will be insulated from criminal prosecution. Orders the Navy’s Seal Team 6 to as- sassinate a political rival? Immune. Organizes a military coup to hold onto power? Immune. Takes a bribe in ex- change for a pardon? Immune. Immune, immune, immune.
Article II, Section 4: The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.
I really don’t know what she’s going on about and I’m a little concerned.
The only reason they separated out official acts is to stall the ruling on trump’s case. If it goes back to the SCOTUS they will say all acts are official but rule on the very last day they can. They are doing this to delay it until after the election.
That article states they will be removed if convicted. The new ruling states that for anything considered “official”, the president can no longer be convicted. That’s the problem.
That is NOT what they have ruled. They have ruled that there is a presumptive immunity. That means it can be challenged upon judicial review.
The President enjoys no immunity for his unofficial acts, and not everything the President does is official. The President is not above the law. But under our system of separated powers, the President may not be prosecuted for exercising his core constitutional powers, and he is entitled to at least presumptive immunity from prosecution for his official acts. That immunity applies equally to all occupants of the Oval Office.
Roberts then goes on to explain how all but one of the charges need to go back to the courts to determine if he was acting in an official capacity.
For eight years we’ve been told we’re overreacting as we predict all this stuff like Trump stuffing the courts with conservative activists, overturning Roe, killing chevron deference, and generally legislating from the bench. Poorly written law can be interpreted however they like. True or not, the SCOTUS majority has proven that they don’t care what’s written in the constitution, law books, etc. Whether or not you think the law can be interpreted a certain way, they are now set up to do whatever they like because even though they don’t make the laws, they actually, implicitly do.
SCOTUS majority has proven that they don’t care what’s written in the constitution
That’s an odd take being that they’re heavily relying on Article II to define which of a president’s actions are immune and everything outside of that is either open to interpretation or absolutely NOT immune.
Hey, many actual members of the bar have said it is now legal (in that he is immune from prosecution) for Joe Biden to order the military to kill Donald Trump. You’ll forgive me if I trust their analysis over that of oxjox@lemmy.ml.
I’d like to know what has changed. My assumption is that it has always been legal given it was done for reasonable reasons (national security, etc). Are they claiming that now the president can kill anyone they wish with no reason whatsoever? Has this wholly removed the fourth section of Article II?
The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.
Welcome back to another episode of “Where’s Humanity Going to Shit Next?”, where we tackle the depressing consequences of the actions of the human race to our beloved planet Earth. This episode we visit the US once again, where the president decides he now has the power to kill you himself if he feels like it.
Join us next time to see where humanity is really gonna shit next.
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