Jon nailed it that covering this stuff isn’t necessarily an issue unless something more important comes up.
And sure we could say these news outlets could cover a range of topics if not just teach civics when nothing is happening… But they’re viewer/profit driven.
If they’re arguing in bad faith, odds are high they’re just a right-wing operative intending to sow defeatism and wedge-drive. Often they’ll pretend being a concerned centrist but nowadays they feign being a leftist or tankie, which kills two birds with one stone.
With this in mind don’t stop commenting, just make your strongest arguments upfront and target the bystander audience. It’s the only way to act as damage-control. But don’t waste your time with them, specifically.
Whoa whoa wait now. You forgot to apply Paragraph #2 to the first as well, in addition to the fact that the first also seeks to enable genocide in Ukraine.
Video of former President Donald Trump vowing to terminate the Affordable Care Act (ACA) went viral on social media on Friday after he reversed his position on the issue last month....
“SoCiAlism bAd!” said the veteran who lived on base, shopped at the commissary, used the GI Bill and then takes a social security check every month with guv’mint insurance.
Republicans have done this for decades to great success. Usually they’ll push a wedge-driving issue with online operatives sometimes posing as grandstanding leftists who will vote 3rd party, independent, etc.
It rarely works for Dems, but Libertarians did screw over Trump to some extent last election thanks to Jojo
You really have no idea what you’re talking about, for this is spoken like someone still of college age. Forget shortsighted. Sure it may be one thing if you’re adept with auto mechanics, but most people frankly are not.
You do realize there is an inflection-point in both cost and reliability (forgetting newer safety and fuel standards) when owning used vehicles…riiiighhht?
That wasn’t me but on reflection I apologize for coming off so harshly.
I don’t know their situation but sharing a single vehicle can really suck especially if both work and you want to divide and conquer on getting shit done.
Spot-on analysis. Public approval of Israeli action was already shifting heavily away within just the last 2 months. This of course before the latest debacle this past week. As the polls go, so too will Biden… Hopefully.
The other thing is Trump has basically been in campaign mode for years already. Biden and the broader coalition is only starting to ramp up now, and the fundraising has been good. As the money starts being spent that’s going to certainly have some impact.
That said I’m still not convinced pollsters have managed go dial in millennials let alone zoomers.
The next best thing is that UN committees can investigate and identify genocide without it necessarily being vetoed. Once the UN and especially ICJ identify such genocide, that adds global pressure; such global pressure leads to supporters of Israel to reconsider holding Israel’s hands; hence why the US in an unprecedented move has stepped further away from Israel than it has for decades. People don’t understand just how closely-linked Israel and US have been. I never would’ve thought a sitting US President would say a bad word about Israel/Bibi without fear of major backlash. We’re certainly at an inflection point — and it’s about fucking time.
Edit: Also, let’s not all pretend we’re human rights lawyers who can definitively define what is and what isn’t genocide. If the ICJ took the case up and thought there was merit in the case, then one should probably hold their tongue; after all, according to the ICC:
First, the crime of genocide is characterised by the specific intent to destroy in whole or in part a national, ethnic, racial or religious group by killing its members or by other means: causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; or forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
Note: National; note religious; note “whole OR in part” On the flip-side, then we’d have to say Hamas wasn’t carrying out an attempt of genocide with October 7th, since they killed Palestinian Muslims among the Jewish population.
It’s kind of a moot point. At this point Israel has committed something around 20 October 7ths in the number of civilian deaths they’ve incurred in Gaza. With an estimated 80:20 civilian-combatant death ratio according to US figures, that’s well-above average. Forgetting the fact that more aid workers have died in this war than any previous one in decades… This is a travesty. So the question remains: If we’re all pro-civilian and anti-terrorist… Even if Israel didn’t do anything in Gaza and just enhanced its border protections, then what are the odds when looking at it from a quantifiable standpoint Hamas would be able to commit another 20 (and counting) October 7ths? (forgetting the fact that even before October 7th the IDF committed the vast-majority of civilian casualties for decades).
What kind of shady shit are you pulling to try to side-step the fact that this was, by definition, a ceasefire? Yes, China and Russia vetoed a ceasefire.
Also let’s not pretend Russia and China are acting out of humanitarian interest.
(Also, choosing between no ceasefire and Israel committing collective punishment, or a ceasefire and israel committing collective punishment — welp, I’d surmise the latter is better.)
“Russia and China veto US resolution calling for immediate cease-fire in Gaza”
Russia and China on Friday vetoed a U.S.-sponsored United Nations resolution supporting “an immediate and sustained cease-fire” in the Israel-Hamas war in Gaza
I acknowledge your point and agree there is contradiction in AP and Reuters’ headline. On the other hand release of hostages is kind of a given to accept a sustained ceasefire. Hamas must come to the table in some capacity. After all, it isn’t really even the hostages that are preventing Israel from bombing Gaza into oblivion. And it isn’t the hostages that is spurring public outcry, but rather the death of Palestinian civilians already occurring. So anything that advances the protections of those civilians should be paramount, and that includes hostages.
The text demanded “an immediate ceasefire for the month of Ramadan leading to a lasting sustainable ceasefire”. It also demanded the release of hostages but did not make a truce dependent on them being freed, as Washington had previously demanded.
Not sure I agree with that personally, nor that China and Russia are some sort of concerned humanitarian forces in the region, but alas.
Hamas would have to commit 20 x October 7ths in order to achieve the cruelty Israel willingly carried out among civilians of Gaza—and aid workers—half of the dead being women and children.
Your response? Something-something, “ends justify the means”?
Unfortunately there are more nefarious forces that intend to sow defeatism and apathy. I had one such buffoon tell me they’re voting 3rd party. Don’t fall for this garbage.
Historians, scholars, political-scientists all disagree. I won’t argue with the proverbial-equivalent of flat-earthers, for that’s just a denialism too far gone.
I’m all for people demanding things in the streets. That’s not the same as what you’ve been suggesting, which is to vote third-party. These two things are two entirely different things.
Black Panthers didn’t hold legitimate Congressional power like Democrats. So again, thank Democrats in Congress for passing it. Something you risk spoiling by letting Republicans get into office.
He hasn’t? I’m pretty sure universal healthcare is more popular than ever among Democrats; and things like tuition reimbursement would’ve been inconceivable merely 10-years-ago.
There is ambiguity in your argument of them creeping to the right.
It’s a fact that 3rd-party lose universally all of their elections while often spoiling elections for the primary party that most-closely shares their interests. This is not a counter-factual; this is not Ad Ignorantiam.
It’s an apt comparison, reflective of the non-sequitur you’re engaging in. Lacking any substantive rebuttal or sourced rebuttal, it’s a reflection of what I see in flat-earthers.
I suppose you’ve heard that old adage of, “the enemy of my enemy is my friend.” After all, we sort of utilized that during WWII to fight the nazis,
So he hasn’t moved his policies whatsoever for Haley voters; he’s only appealing to never-Trump voters in order to ensure the real fascist doesn’t get elected. You following?
And yet, you act as though the better alternative was not sleeping with the dogs and letting the Nazis win?
Which outcome would you have preferred? Think ahead here, my friend.
Also, why would Biden need to move his policies if he’s pretty conservative to begin with?
I’m simply responding to the notion that Biden is “moving right” by appealing to Haley voters. I’ve still yet to see any evidence whatsoever of this claim. Inviting Haley voters into a preestablished structure isn’t “moving right.” Saying Biden is conservative to begin with != “moving right.” One is a present state; the other is a transitioning state that has yet to be evidenced in any capacity.
I seriously doubt Haley voters will be permanently welcomed in, or rather, I doubt they’ll stay themselves. I think they’ll dip the second another Romney-esque corporate Republican comes about – and Biden is just too left of Romney for them to stay for long.
Either way, they’re a useful tool to ensure Trump doesn’t get elected. Like you said, we are working with Haley voters for “a common cause of defeating the nazis” in November. Let’s not put the cart before the horse. Let’s cross that bridge when we come to it. Let’s worry about make-up of the party after we defeat the literal nazis in November, yes?
I don’t see evidence to support the claim that Biden moving “any” more right and he’d be Trump. He’d have to transition quite a few ticks before achieving that; nevertheless, we should always embrace “less Trump” than Trump himself, so I’ll take it. The thing is, I still haven’t seen any evidence presented whatsoever that Biden as “moved right” to appeal to Haley voters. Until you can provide a modicum of evidence to this, I think your claim is dead in the water.
Biden could suddenly appeal to nazis/stormfront/proud boys if he wanted to earn their votes, too, but he clearly doesn’t. And therein lies the difference: Haley voters vs. Stormfront/proud boys. If you think there is minimal distance between these two groups then I don’t know what to say. The mere point that we can’t agree on this is exemplary as to why Biden must make concessions with the electorate in the first place in order to ensure the far-worse poison doesn’t get into the White House in November.
Until you can provide an alternative solution to rally voters to put Biden over the 270 electoral votes, this is pie-in-the-sky dreaming in my view. Nevertheless, I appreciate the cordial discussion.
I see your concerns and find many of your points reasonable here. If you could be more explicit about what concessions to progressives he could give that he hasn’t already and wouldn’t otherwise jeopardizing another key voting-bloc in swing-states with swing-votes nonetheless, I’d be really interested to know. In that respect – even among long-time progressives – Biden has been one of the more progressive Presidents we’ve had. Even Bernie, AOC , Warren agree.
What I’m saying is I think it’s clear that Bernie sat down with Biden in order to receive his endorsement, put Bernie in a leading budgetary role, and Biden pivoted left relative to where he was, say, 10-years-ago.
Circling back to my comment before: How far can he capitulate before it backfires with another voting bloc and again risks the literal nazi winning in just 8 months time?
Thanks for the insight, I mean it. There is much agree with here — namely this: That the progressive grassroots organizers are the backbone of this country and that lacking voter-enthusiasm can cripple the momentum of the election, even if they vote themselves. I’ve made the same argument countless times when discussing the pitfalls of Hillary and to a lesser extent the risks to Biden. I also do agree there is merit to advocating for a policy that while it may be unpopular is the right thing to do. People with convictions are attractive; that’s what distinguishes a good leader from an average leader — one who can see ahead of the curve and convince people of a direction before they get there. Unfortunately I don’t think Biden is that; and I don’t think that can happen in the 8 months we have left. What the polls are will likely be where they remain for many of these issues.
My response breaks down across 4 main points:
Whether liberals will break with Biden, or whether progressives will — and really, neither of these groups will likely break. These aren’t the swing-voters in swing-states. What, are progressives who are traditionally the most-educated and civic-engaged ideological group suddenly decide to let Trump win? How will that advance their goals except for taking 2 or more steps back?
The vast majority of the shit that needs addressed and is being ignored as you mention is a direct result of the GOP obstructionism, combined with systemic such as the Supreme Court and Electoral College — NOT because Democrats don’t desire to do it. Every single thing Biden is doing is related to how popular things are; that’s the problem: appealing to millions of people from a wide variety of backgrounds. Sure you and I want the filibuster removed, but low-educated rural swing-voters in Ohio, Nevada, Arizona don’t even know what a filibuster is.
I worry there’s an element to the leftist movement that armchair purity tests at the cost of advancing progress. Instead of recognizing Bernie and AOC for what they’re doing — actually running for office and seeing how the system operates from the inside — there are a lot who just cast them off as never being on their side in the first place, which I personally think is heavily myopic. In other words: What’s more likely: that Bernie, AOC, Warren are traitors, or the Lemmy crowd of tankies of sub-22-year-olds are woefully out-of-touch with reality all the while possibly being subject to right-wing astroturfing to wedge-drive?
Yes the right-wing media machine will constantly call Biden Pro-Hamas, but it won’t stick as effectively with critical swing-voters and apathetics as if he, for example, withdrew aid. Forget the the massive risk again in doing so when if Israel suffers another October 7th then everyone will paint Biden as leaving Israel defenseless and antisemitic. This is simply not good optics and would give the propaganda from the right legitimate bite with said swing-voters. I’m no advisor to Biden but if I was this would certainly be a consideration, for I don’t even rule out a false-flag for Netanyahu.
No worries I can relate and appreciate the comment and apologies for taking so long to respond. Holidays, work, etc. For the record this will likely be my final response and I’ll oblige you with the final word
When we talk about “lesser” genocide, I’m referring to any friction, any resistance, any braking – if that means merely one less death than the inevitable alternative, then we should logically take that. I don’t have to like either option, but it’s always wiser to take the less-potent poison when it’s a forced dichotomy.
Like you I can’t reside in that camp of accelerationist “let it all crash and burn” because entropy dictates that picking up the pieces will be orders-of-magnitude more cost-intensive in all resources including time and lives.
Genocidal Intent is another thing; for I believe Trump has full intent of genocide while Biden does not have the intent of genocide. I think it is imperative we recognize that it is Netanyahu specifically committing genocide.
With respect to protesting Biden, not voting, and letting Trump in yet somehow derailing him as the proverbial trolly in a manner presumably akin to January 6th, I think that’s just a bridge too far. Why let it go that far to begin with when you can put the brakes on now while transforming the Democratic party as the nation shifts from being less conservative to more progressive as the old boomers die off?
This is the problem we have at hand: The vast majority of this country is still more conservative than we care to admit, and while there are people like us who are far ahead of the curve, we have to drag these people along with us like a ball-and-chain. We have to spoon-feed them reality at the right time and place, such as legalizing same-sex marriage, marijuana legalization, universal healthcare, etc… And eventually, we do get them to finally “catch up,” but it takes time.
I’m not too much of a fan of the idea of violent revolution; after all I have my kids to think of and we have all the tools at our disposal to avoid that right here and right now. Further I have to part ways with you on Garland, for I think he’s doing a fantastic job. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: You can have a strong legal case, or a fast legal case – but you can’t have both. Especially when concerning the unprecedented nature of the charges and status of the person you’re indicting – mostly because of the great amount of outside money that will prop up and defend Trump as your department will be smeared as a political witch-hunt. Garland is a straight-shooter in my book, and it was genius to appoint Jack Smith as special counsel. Whether it comes in time and whether the stacked SCOTUS will impact this is obviously the question, but perhaps we shouldn’t have abandoned Obama in crucial midterms both in 2010 and 2014 and this wouldn’t have been an issue in the first place.
I respectfully object to the notion that the GOP blocking everything will be a constant. I’m not sure how old you are but I remember a time when the line between the two parties was so blurred they really could be the same. Especially circa 2001-2003. It’s incredible we have progressives like AOC and Bernie and Warren who are taking senior leadership roles and who have legitimate influence over the party. Such individuals didn’t even exist within the Democratic coalition in Congress. Republicans are desperate. They know the writing is on the wall for their party. Their voting demographic is literally dying away and they are making enough inroads with other minority groups without ultimately disenfranchising the very base that is keeping them afloat: white males who are very often racist and bigoted. They’ve forked themselves, and every 4 years that drags by yields more to the Millennials and Zoomer generation. It’s almost inevitable they go the way of the Whigs, which is why they are so scared. Either way, I don’t feel this changes my original point which is to say that Biden cannot be blamed for not being more progressive when even the progressive policies he implements — such as a tuition bailout for the working-class — is blocked by the Right. Doesn’t matter WHO you put in there, that would be a given. So first we must focus on convincing people to join hands and wipe Republicans out. Only then we can focus on policy and the direction of the country.
If it were between Hitler and Trump I’d vote Trump out of his sheer incompetence but it would still be a problem; but let’s also not pretend that that the choices are remotely comparable to these; for I believe that’s woefully disingenuous. Biden has many good intentions but again are blocked by the other side. Meanwhile Hitler and Trump effectively share the identical ideological banner.
With respect to progressives perceiving the likes of AOC and Bernie, I must lean to the notion that they are still more informed on the nuances of the issues compared to the average critics thereof. More importantly they see the bigger picture of what is at stake. They know Biden is persuadable. They know Biden at least has concerns about Palestinians. They know Trump would NEVER say that Israel is committing “indiscriminate bombing.” They know there is no chance of withdrawing aid to Israel with Trump. They do know, however, there is a chance with Biden. Moreover such progressives absolutely did raise concerns sooner than 6 months; the only problem is that they know they can give the rope to let Israel hang themselves and in turn you USA can be perceived as reacting to their documented atrocities as opposed to getting ahead of polling and jeopardizing losing the election and letting the significantly-worse threat to Palestinians get in for 4 years. That is the gambit at play.
So my thought-process if distilled to bullet-points goes something like this:
Trump is far worse than Biden for both Palestinians, Ukrainians, and the American people.
The rematch and choice of these two candidates is inevitable.
Biden must therefore win the 2024 election.
Biden must toe the line between progressives and larger more critical voting-blocs of apathetic/ignorant swing-voters (of who 1/3 are undecided on Israeli actions and 1/3 support their actions), and progressive activists.
Biden cannot get ahead of the polls without risking reelection
Biden cannot withdraw aid without setting himself up for a false-flag.
The Democrats are softly pulling themselves away from Israel, which I think is the smart move.
"Are you trying to make this OJ?": Jon Stewart warns media's Trump trial coverage could backfire (www.salon.com)
Daily Show host blasts media for treating the “most mundane bulls**t” as “Earth-shattering”...
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Video of Trump vowing to terminate Obamacare goes viral after he backtracks (www.newsweek.com)
Video of former President Donald Trump vowing to terminate the Affordable Care Act (ACA) went viral on social media on Friday after he reversed his position on the issue last month....
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Trump Allies Have a Plan to Hurt Biden’s Chances: Elevate Outsider Candidates (www.nytimes.com)
This works because almost all the US uses first-past-the-post elections for the Presidential general election. So you get outcomes like this:...
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TLDR: Totalling roughly $144 billion for about 4 million borrows....
The polls are suggesting a huge shift in the electorate. Are they right? | Politico (www.politico.com)
cross-posted from: lemmy.world/post/14025725...
Germans: what genocide? (lemmy.world)
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Trump would "level" Gaza without a thought, ex-aide warns (www.newsweek.com)
I feel so old. (lemmy.world)
Netanyahu says Israeli strike unintentionally killed Gaza aid workers (www.bbc.com)
A Judge Finally Found Fraudulent Votes. They’re All From a Republican. (newrepublic.com)
A prominent Georgia state Republican, who has repeatedly claimed the 2020 election was stolen, was found to have voted illegally nine times....
Biden reacts to pro-Palestinian protesters: 'They have a point' (www.nbcnews.com)