How is this not foreign interference? It should be doubly so if money is free speech. They are directly influencing our lives, at all.90 winning, I’d even say those tinfoil hat jyoo conspiracy theorists have some credence, its just Israel not the Jewish people.
Oh, it absolutely is, but it’s ok because it was used against a progressive. Which party is gonna do something about it? The one that hates progressives, or the other one that really hates progressives?
Foreign funding and domestic funding with the express purpose of gaining advantage for a foreign nation is a distinction without any practical difference.
Eli5: How does record AIPAC spending prevent people from voting? It still comes down to people voting so isn’t it safe to say more people voted for the person who won than people who voted for the losing candidate?
Edit: come on this isn’t reddit. I’m not concerned with this question of who was running and what they are in favor of. As far as I have been attentive to politics there has always been campaign contributions from lobbyists with the intent to have their interests protected. I do not understand why or how that would affect the outcome of the election unless one candidates total campaign funds were a pot more than the others. I also don’t understand why is thes any new precedent? Hopefully with this added clarity the down votes won’t burry the comment and further discussion can be had.
But how does that keep people from voting? I’m not being a dick it’s a genuine question. Corporations dump trillions into advertising but that doesn’t prevent me from comparing products and choosing the product that best fits my needs. Matter of fact, there was a post today I saw that was about the futility of targeted ads having no better results than traditional marketing.
Sorry you’re getting downvoted to hell. You’re right. Sometimes people want everything to be a conspiracy or something aside from the simpler truth which is that voters just wanted somebody different.
It doesn’t. But it puts their agenda up front and center for those that can be manipulated by it a whole lot easier.
Sort of similar to how people here will urge you to not vote for Biden. Most people will see this as people essentially just shitting into a fan, but at its core, it’s really a way to circumvent having to directly show support for Trump on a left-leaning social media platform where they’d get banned.
So where did all the pro-Isreal propaganda get pushed to? The anti-Isreal propaganda is everywhere. (I don’t know a better word than propaganda to use here but I don’t mean it as any sense of invalidating or dismissing eirher the anti-Isreal/pro-Isreal sentiment)
Personally, I think there’s a fuck-ton of nuance to the issue and I find that it’s best not to listen to a bunch of high-school kids lecturing everyone on who to vote for based on foreign affairs that they weren’t even aware were happening less than a year ago.
Where the others went?
This is lemmy. You’re not allowed to accept that the situation is nuance led as fuck. Even if you mostly agree with the hive.
I said I was ignoring you then. And I did. And now I’m ignoring your current nonsense now. You see, it’s a thing that can be activated at will. And don’t mistake my responding to you as some form of hypocrisy. Or that your little trolling attempt was successful. I’m fully allowed to respond to whatever bullshit you bring me. That is my right. I will however choose when I wish- to ignore discussing whatever dumb shit you try and bring up as a means to distract from the point to create a straw man as is pretty much ALL you do.
And considering that you’re incapable of stopping yourself from mouthing off at anyone who dares to disagree with your little agenda, it’s pretty easy to do.
You should probably get used to it. I have seen that I’m not the only one that does it.
Oh, and for the record- and on the topic of ignoring things… As I’ve said and you’ve ignored before- I don’t have a problem with the far left.
I have a huge problem with the “far left.” And you should too.
Two things. Opposition to genocide is not a “little agenda” just because it pisses you off to see people who don’t unconditionally support everything centrist Democrats do.
And your distinction about the far left versus the “far left”? Bullshit. You hate everyone to your left and tell yourself that they’re to your right to justify it.
One- You seem to take GREAT offense to my accusing some people of being fake far lefters. So much so that you can’t help yourself and seem compelled to respond to my every comment about it. It’s almost like… you’re incapable of not responding to my every comment on the topic. It’s like… yOu jUsT cAn’T iGnOre mE! (Waaah!)
Two- gEnOciDe is absolutely a “little agenda.” When positioned from the perspective of the far right trolls that pretend to support it. The same people you get incredibly upset about when people accuse you of being- but adamantly defend them when people go on the offensive on them.
You really need to choose a lane buddy.
And three- you claim time-and-again that you’re going to vote for Biden. At this point: I’m calling bullshit. And I’m pretty sure we both know it’s bullshit. And my evidence is One and Two from just above this paragraph if you need a reference.
This is not what ignoring me looks like. This is utterly indistinguishable from previous conversations we’ve had, except you’ve made your genocide support much clearer.
Everything to your left must be all the way to your right. You’ve never considered once that genocide is wrong and that you’re wrong for supporting it.
And I don’t support genocide no matter how much you interpret my opposition to MAGA bots parading themselves around as far lefters.
Dude… you’re not getting the point I’ve tried to fucking tell you- over and over again!
I’m not accusing you of shit. If you’re legit- you’re fine. But you HAVE to know here are bad actors among you. And the fact that you STILL constantly come at me when I’m only trying to pull weeds from YOUR garden, makes me think you want them there.
If you’re not in favor of a Trump win and genuinely don’t support him in any way, then why not join me and the others in weeding out those among you that are there in bad faith?
And I don’t support genocide no matter how much you interpret my opposition to MAGA bots parading themselves around as far lefters.
You have no evidence whatsoever of these “maga bots” except that they oppose Netanyahu’s genocide. That’s not evidence. That’s you making shit up about people you disagree with.
I’m not accusing you of shit.
You keep calling me a trumpist.
But you HAVE to know here are bad actors among you
Yeah, I’m talking to one. You constantly lie about the anti-genocide left because you want to discredit the left, opposition to genocide, or both.
If you’re not in favor of a Trump win and genuinely don’t support him in any way, then why not join me and the others in weeding out those among you that are there in bad faith
I’m not going to join your personal mccarthyist inquisition against everyone to your left just because you’ve imagined that there’s Russian psyops behind every rock.
I honestly don’t get your angle here.
Like I said last time you said this: I criticize those to my right. You should try it sometime.
Holy shit! I don’t think I have ever in my life seen someone choose what they want someone else to say more than you do. And the amount of people you do this to is…. Well. Everyone you disagree with. Your modlog show that.
So it seems you either have a VERY serious reading comprehension problem, or you’re willfully trolling.
My guess is it’s both.
I’m done wasting time with you on this, so go ahead and have the all important last word you always seem to so badly crave. I’m going to go ahead and take the high road out of this embarrassment of a discussion. I’ll be temporarily blocking you so I don’t even get notified that you responded. That’s how little I am interested in hearing what you have to say.
But don’t think to bring this up as some antagonistic bullshit excuse to accuse me of paying attention to your nonsense after I said I wouldn’t. You’re not that good of a troll. I’m just simply done with THIS discussion. As I was done with the other individual discussions.
I’ll be temporarily blocking you so I don’t even get notified that you responded.
Next time you badmouth the anti-genocide left for being both anti-genocide and to your left, I’ll be there. And you will have conveniently unblocked me, just like you totally ignored me.
Decided to check in on you after Biden’s performance at the debate, and I find you getting utterly trounced by someone who seems to be fully on the level. If you can’t understand why someone would be at least hesitant to support Genocide Joe (while fully acknowledging that Genocide Donald is our only other option), I just can’t take you seriously.
Are you implying that by spending more money they are blocking you from seeing the opposition? That’s absolutely not the case.
It would be more like people raising hands around you and you see mostly green hands and only a few blue hands and thus less-informed people will be more likely to lean towards the majority.
That’s an awfully… interesting way of saying he lost his primary, which as an incumbent is not a particularly easy to do. Blame foreign money all you want, your voters voted for who they wanted. Primary voters are the most politically aware kind of voters, most people don’t vote, even fewer take the time to vote in primaries. Apparently those voters wanted somebody new.
Then why did they spend $15 million on a primary campaign? Why does a campaign for President costs $1 billion now? Maybe 🤔 they just like spending money.
I remember when the party threw its weight behind Henry Cuellar because his opponent was a progressive, and claimed it was because he was an incumbent.
I’m usually against Sanders on this, but I very much respect the risky part of that sentence. Because I just don’t have a lot of faith in the future right now, and I don’t know if I trust any nuclear options going forward. I mean after Trump wins the election and implements his project f, or whatever it was called, who’s going to be the head of the nuclear regulatory agency? One of his shitty kids friends? Maybe Sanders is right and it’s a bad time.
Would you be surprised that we have dozens of nuclear plants all over the United States? Modern reactors that can withstand the mistakes of the past without the disaster? Media makes the public think the risk is higher than it is when in reality, more people have died per year installing renewables than all the nuclear disasters combined (per GW/H).
Right now the volume of waste is low enough that they store it on-site. Coal ash disposal is far more of a problem, and has led to major contamination incidents.
What figures do you have on decomissioning? How much does a coal or natural gas plant or oil refinery cost to decommission? Do plants need to be decommissioned or can they be incrementally upgraded?
Have you done any background on this or are you sealioning?
Edit: Oh. 17 of the earliest plants starting from the 50s. This has nothing to do with the construction and maintenance of modern nuclear power infrastructure.
Solar and wind are cheaper, but are variable, and have geographic limitations or high land use (45,000 acres of solar to equal the output of a modern nuclear plant). There is a place for nuclear, along with other carbon-free generation sources.
I wish it was more widely known by the average person that coal ash is radioactive and contains heavy metals like lead and arsenic due to concentration of elements that were found in trace amounts in the coal and remain once the coal is burnt. It’s horrible how poorly coal ash was handled (or purposefully used in construction) in the past and how contamination events still happen with little meaningful consequence to energy companies.
In the ground, very deep, forever, for not nearly as much money as you might think. It takes up very, very little space. It’s not green liquid, it’s pieces of glass.
Also he’s not in office. It’s kinda like getting upset if George Santos said something insane.
I get that people are working hard to find evidence for the “Israel = Nazis” narrative that’s currently trending, but kinda scraping the bottom of the barrel aren’t we?
Or, here’s another way of looking at it. Man who voluntarily left the ruling party of Israel and remains a part of Israel’s political class quotes Hitler. Not in the way we all quote Hitler to show that a point of view is wrong because Hitler held it, but rather in the way we quote someone like Nelson Mandela or Albert Einstein; to support an argument because we respect the source.
Meaning, Israeli politician respects Hitler.
Israel=Nazis is trending because the Israeli regime is genocidal, just like the Nazi regime that necessitated the creation of Israel, which is tragically ironic. This news piece is just garnish.
I see people constantly invoking the Nazis to make excuses for the actions of Hamas. The logic is “Israel is like Nazis therefore everything Hamas does it permissible.” It’s idiotic reasoning but it’s commonplace here.
This guy is similarly idiotic. If you’re outraged by what this guy is saying, look at the rationalizations people on here do everyday in support of Hamas. It’s the same eye for an eye kind of thinking. “Other side is Nazis, therefore we should do horrible things!”
Ex Likud members which used to be part of the Knesset that are now running their own party and saying this stuff on mainstream israeli TV channels does indicate something.
Unless they arrested this guy for saying literal Nazi shit on TV of course. Surely israel would do that right.
The Palestinian singer Dalal Abu Amneh was arrested briefly this week when she went to a police station to file a complaint after receiving hundreds of death threats. Rather than investigating her complaint, police detained her because of a comment she posted on Facebook, said her lawyer, Abir Bakr.
“They put cuffs on her hands and feet, and subjected her to insults and humiliation. They want to frighten people and teach them a lesson through Dalal,” Bakr said. After the start of Israel’s bombardment of Gaza, Abu Amneh had posted “there is no victor but Allah” alongside a Palestinian flag on her Facebook page.
Invoking literal Hitler in a context that literally calls for literal Genocide on mainstream TV, does call into question if there are any double standards present here.
Now that antisemitism isn’t a problem anymore for israel either since they’re literally quoting Hitler it’s getting pretty obvious that israel is just doing Nazi Germany and white power.
See the difference between you and I is that I attribute the actions on October 7 to Hamas, not the Palestinian people. But you see any Israeli doing something wrong you use it to paint everyone in Israel as being that way.
You can split hairs about whether that’s antisemitism, but I don’t care. When you see one person of an ethnicity and/or religious group doing something wrong and then go on to say “they” do things like that, you’re showing what kind of person you are.
I tend to say Jew when when someone trends towards hating all Israelis, because hatred towards Israel is a common dog whistle for antisemites. After the “It’s ok to criticize Israel” meme went viral, many antisemites did a find and replace on “Jew” and changed it to “Israeli”. Those same antisemitic conspiracy theories most people would immediately denounced by most people before are now commonly spread simply because one word was changed. When I see those conspiracy theories espoused with one word different from the original, I bring it back to the original version. Why would I pretend that I don’t know the intent for these conspiracy theories?
Sometimes it’s important to take what you’re saying and put the word Jew in there. If what you’re saying about Israel suddenly becomes uncomfortable when “Israeli” is replaced with “Jew”, then you should consider more carefully what you’re saying. Someone says “wipe them off the map” they are talking about the ethnic cleansing of Jews after all. Or do you honestly believe that those that want Israel wiped off the map would displace Arab Israelis along with the Jewish Israelis? Come on…
The trick to avoid being a racist is introspection. Some consideration about whether your thinking is being guided by racism every now and then. If it’s uncomfortable to hear your rhetoric being applied to Jews rather than Israelis or “Zionists”, then maybe you should be checking how you’re thinking about things a little more.
If me considering your rhetoric as being against Jews makes you uncomfortable, then good. Your discomfort might lead to introspection.
You don’t seem to understand a lot about history with regards to Jews. Someone can consider themself to be a Jew if they are in the Judaism religion, and they can consider themself a Jew If one or both of their parents are Jews. Sometimes people that don’t consider themself to be a Jew can be considered a Jew by others even if just one of their Grandparents were a Jew.
All of these have been oppressed in the past. Oppression of Jews generally goes in cycles. Tolerance for a few generations, but then animosity builds up over time. Since Jews are a minority group they’re an easy target, and if a minority group achieves any measure of success people become jealous and a minority group having success runs counter to white supremacist ideology. Paranoia builds up, lots of conspiracy theories around Jews being successful because they used manipulation and took things that rightfully belonged to someone else.
Then a massacre happens and most people are horrified by it. So the majority of people go back to tolerating Jews again. But after a few generations people go back to the paranoia and jealous hatred against a minority group for achieving any kind of success.
The last cycle when antisemitism reached it’s maximum, there were no countries that offered sanctuary to Jews. I don’t think that will be the case on this cycle because while there’s few people left who personally witnessed the holocaust, most people in positions of power at least knew someone who was affected by it. But on the next cycle? What happens if the people that say October 7 was justified are the majority and are in positions of power in the west? The tankie pro-Palestinian protest kids of todady will likely be the MAGAs of tomorrow. It’s easy to see the potential of repeat of every country in the world refusing to offer sanctuary to Jews that are the victims of oppression.
And that’s why Israel exists. It’s not a religious state. It’s also not an ethno-state. It’s a state that exists to provide sanctuary for victims of antisemitism. A lot of people are uncomfortable with the existence of Israel because it’s a reminder of our failure to have any level of humanity towards Jews in the past.
I hope there’s a day where it isn’t necessary for there to be a country that has a Jewish majority to ensure there’s at least one country that offers sanctuary to Jews during times of peak antisemitism. But seeing attacks on synagogues and attacks on Jewish businesses in the west, we’re unfortunately not there yet.
I thinking Bowman might have missed the Overton window in his district:
Bowman’s troubles started last fall, when he began speaking out in the days after Oct. 7 as one of Congress’s leading critics of Israel’s war with Hamas. His stand — for a cease-fire and against American military aid — galvanized younger Democrats and the party’s left flank.
But in a heavily Jewish district, it also helped foment a backlash that led Jewish leaders to recruit a formidable primary challenger, George Latimer; prompted a pro-Israel lobby to pump a record-shattering $15 million into the race; and eventually lit a match under old tensions over race, class and ideology.
Edit: After thinking about this some more I feel like this is a great example of what makes being a politician so hard and why sometimes taking the stand on right side of history can make things worse.
Bowman obviously wants to do the right thing and end the Gaza invasion, so he spoke out publicly against it. He doesn't seem to understand his constituency though, and as a result there's a good chance he's going to lose his seat at the table.
Unfortunately his speaking out publucly doesn't really seem to have moved the needle towards improving the situation in Gaza.
So by speaking out without understanding his constituents he might be losing his seat, we citizens of the United States are potentially losing one vote for progressive issues, we're potentially gaining a vote for aggressive pro-Isreali causes, and the invasion of Gaza rolls on without even noticing.
So was Bowman's sacrifice worth it? I guess we'll see in November.
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