A New York appeals court on Monday agreed to hold off collection of former President Donald Trump’s $454 million civil fraud judgment — if he puts up $175 million within 10 days.
If he does, it will stop the clock on collection and prevent the state from seizing his assets while he appeals.
He led an insurrection on the capitol building almost half a decade ago and he’s still walking free and running for president. Do you think he has seen any meaningful consequences, or does money make the world go round?
I’m not saying he didn’t, that it doesn’t, or that he has. It’s just that the whole reason were talking about this is cause he over-inflated the value of his assets and nobody wants to loan him money. Technically, if he had money to pay for this, he wouldn’t be in this predicament. He wouldn’t be begging people to put it on credit. Any reasonable rich person would just pay the damn thing and get it out of the way. Then again he’s not reasonable… but I digress.
I’m sure this was just a “legit” way to get the amount lowered / pander to his base / kiss his ass. It sucks that nobody has the gumption to give him the consequences he deserves, but I don’t care if he says “he has the money,” or had the money in the past to get to the presidency and get everyone on board with his demented plot of world domination. If he doesn’t pay it, he ain’t got it. There’s a reason nobody with actual money would loan it to him.
Did the judge by any chance suddenly get $20 million richer?
How is this not corruption? All lawyers I’ve heard, say you need to put down the full amount. Are they ALL wrong?
It’s full amount to stop the state from beginning to seize assets yes, but his appeal can continue either way. I thought I read/heard that the appellate court did not have the power to do anything with judgements though, other than upheld/overturned. Now I have something to research.
Sure, but if he doesn’t put it up at the beginning, why does anyone think he’ll pay up if he loses? He’ll just keep delaying, as he’s done all along with all of these cases. And if he wins the election, it’ll all go away anyway, which is the “all in” gamble his while life is basically riding on.
And in the meantime, he can devalue and divest while building a political warchest. Deny, deflect, delay. He will not face consequences because there is no justice in America.
He will not face consequences because there is no justice in America.
Trump will die outside of any prison or jailhouse, having never been locked up, likely without even an ankle bracelet, of natural causes, while living a 1% lifestyle. Mark my words.
devalue and divest while building a political warchest
What does that even mean? Don’t be a doomer. Every day he spends in court is less time and money spent on campaigning. Right now he has drained $50 million from Republican election funds to fight this, plus all the time and effort. That’s less time and money spent on supporting downballot Republicans.
Even if he won every case (which won’t happen) this is a distraction for him. Biden hasn’t even started campaigning, and has a massive amount of funding. Trump will lose and every doomer will say “well of course he lost, he was in court half the time! Biden got lucky!”.
Devalue: assets have only theoretical value until they are sold. You can borrow against that theoretical value, but the more you borrow, the less equity you have. Separate from using it as collateral for a loan, the value of an asset can drop for a variety of reasons. Real Estate can fall to disrepair. Stocks can fall due to lowered expectations for the future. If you end up owing more than it’s worth, there’s little incentive not to allow the value to completely evaporate. You can also use the loss to offset capital gains elsewhere, but that’s not particularly relevant here.
Divest: means to sell off assets, with the indication that the sale is at a loss for quick sale. Rich people often engage in the sale of assets to friends, family, and associates who offer pennies on the dollar in exchange for favors. Hiding assets through divestitures is a common tactic for wealthy people who are about to owe a lot of money.
Engaging in both can be used to transfer funds from his personal holdings to his political campaign, which in turn is paying off his legal debts and can be returned to his own pockets after the election. So by increasing the warchest, he is more likely to win the election AND can make himself whole after it is over.
Those definitions don’t mean anything here. Your explanation of how that would benefit him doesn’t make sense.
transfer funds from his personal holdings to his political campaign
That’s not what Trump has ever wanted to do, nor would it help him. Why would selling things and self funding his campaign affect the judgement against him? If anything, he wants to do the opposite.
If you owe a fine, would you give away your possessions? How would that help? It doesn’t make sense.
He’s still on the hook for the full amount if his appeal fails
You know how long appeals can take right? Considering he can now get someone else to pay the relatively small bond, he’ll be dead from old age before he ever has to pay a dime of his own money.
Believe me, I’m not saying this is a good thing. He’s definitely getting special treatment, and I think that’s wrong. However, it’s not quite as bad as it sounds.
This is NOT corruption and Mr. Trump did NOT BRIBE the judge as you are suggesting. The judge is honorable and just and made the announcement out of his own good graces. He even pushed back a flight on his new private jet for a trip he had planned for the christening of his new yacht JUST TO MAKE THIS ANNOUNCEMENT. You people are all just jealous and desperately looking to find some dirt where there clearly isn’t. SAD!
5 days ago I was downvoted for saying this would happen. Yet here we are.
Expect this judgement to get appealed and tossed completely. They can’t do it all in one go as that’s too obvious. Doing a slow roll. Randomly extending the deadline and slashing the bond amount is just the first step. Expect more. Each time easing up even more on Trump.
I don’t really have any faith in the court system anymore. Why should anyone? They control neither the purse nor the sword, and yet unqualified political stooges can dictate policy.
Imagine if we did the same for engineers or doctors. “Hey, my completely unqualified buddy gets to design a bridge, and if it falls down and kills people it is their fault!” It’s ridiculous.
There’s no reason to toss the judgement and the appeals court is a NY State Court. Every single judge has been appointed by a Democratic Governor.
The Court of Appeals consists of seven judges: the Chief Judge and six associate judges who are appointed by the governor and confirmed by the state senate to 14-year terms
There are no legal problems with the case against Trump, and his lying about property values is well documented. They are definitely not going to vacate the judgement.
Your doomer comment makes no sense. This dude is currently fucked. He has to pay $175 million in 10 days, and the rest when the appeals court boots the case. This is clearly bad for him. He should get it over with (if he can), stay out of court, and campaign for president. There’s so many court cases coming that he will have to cancel his rallies, because of time and money constraints.
He has to pay $175M in 10 days. For now. That could get extended. Or reduced. Or both. No reason to assume he’ll be held to that now. All evidence points to it being reduced or extended again.
What evidence? The judges on the NY State Court of Appeals are all appointed by Democrats. More than that, he personally insults judges, making him not a sympathetic defendant to them.
They are tolerating him so that he has no avenues for appeal to the NY State Supreme Court. That’s exactly what Judge Engoron did in this case. Stop being a doomer and take the win.
The fact that they already gave him an extension and a reduction once, just now. How can you be in this thread, yet not paying attention? They are literally at this moment giving him exactly the special treatment you claim there’s “no evidence” for!
Are you not paying attention? I just said they are tolerating him so he has no legal avenues for the judgment to be reduced or appealed. Like it or not, this is what you have to do with clients who have lots of money for lawyers.
He’s not getting away with anything. These judges are making sure he’s 100% fucked. If you don’t understand this principle, just say so. Have you ever followed a court case with a wealthy defendant?
so he has no legal avenues for the judgment to be reduced or appealed
you just plain do not understand what is happening. They are helping him to appeal, the bond amount is part of the appealing process, its collateral put away until the appeal is over and the judgment enforced. This was an appeals court.
they are tolerating him so he has no legal avenues for the judgment to be reduced or appealed.
Of course! If the judges reduce it now then Trump can’t get it reduced later! Just keep reducing it down and there will be nothing for Trump to appeal, brilliant!
I never said it was the judgement, I knew it was the bond but the point remains… Why does he get a break?
Also, he needs to post the bond to appeal, that’s the whole issue here… They are giving him a 60% discount to make it easier for him to appeal… Maybe take your own advice and read about the case more
How about this. The fact the appeals court didn’t even give a reason for the decision. So can the next person that wants to appeal cite this? Not really because there’s no reason to cite. The piss judges couldn’t even be bothered to release their rationale.
There are no legal problems with the case against Trump, and his lying about property values is well documented. They are definitely not going to vacate the judgement.
How many times have we heard this already? “They’re not going to do the thing. If they do the thing, that’s just a bridge too far even for them. Not even they will do the thing to protect Trump.”
Courts: *does the thing.*Lawmakers: do the thing. GOP voters: do the thing. Trump: gets away with it.
Everyone else: Surprisedpicachu.jpg
Trump is facing 91 counts in four criminal trials:
A hush money case where Trump is in little legal peril, is based on shaky legal theory, and puts him at no political risk. And the DA has already caused two delays with their handling of their own evidence.
A RICO Case in Georgia, by far the most important criminal case in the country and easily the most important case in Fani Willis’ career, and she throws the entire case into jeopardy because she cannot keep her personal and professional life separate. (I am not admonishing her for her personal life choices or actions, but when you have a case of this importance to both the nation and your personal career against this defendant, then you should be doing nothing to even give yourself a sniff of conflict of interest, impropriety, or ethics concerns.)
A stolen documents case in Florida being overseen by a judge who was appointed by Trump, has already repeatedly overstepped her authority to run interference for Trump, has deferred to Trump at every step of the case so far, and has openly stated her intentions to dismiss the case after jury selection has begun so double jeopardy attaches and the dismissal can’t be appealed.
A Jan6 case in DC that is currently on indefinite hold while the Supreme Court (3 of which were appointed by Trump himself) decides to wait a couple of months before ruling on whether or not Trump is an absolute dictator that is above the law and I wish I were making that up.
Where’s the accountability? And when (not if, when) the $464m award gets tossed out because fuck you thats why, will you continue to believe Trump will ever be held accountable for his actions? Because we have 8 years and counting of history to show that the answer to that question is “No”, and those who are responsible for that accountability seem gleefully willing to bend over backwards to avoid giving it to him.
Until the day I see either Trump or Mar-A-Lago slapped behind a padlock, I will continue to refuse to believe he will ever be held to account.
He still has to pay the whole judgment. This is just the bond ahead of the appeal.
I believe the law was changed recently to prevent people from appealing and delaying the judgment. So a few years ago, he wouldn’t have had to pay anything right now.
There’s no way property would have been seized and sold by the end of today anyway. So getting $175 million in cash now and $280 million in property in a month is almost the same.
Not particularly, because reducing the appeals bond means that Trump can delay the trial even longer - which is the plan. Pretty much everyone sees that his plan from the beginning has been to push back and delay as long as possible, preferably until he’s either confirmed as the Republican nominee (in which case he can beat the wardrum of “oh this is a political witch hunt, you can’t sue a major political candidate”) or, more preferably, he wins the election, in which case I’m sure the DOJ will move double-quick to find a way for him to not have to pay a cent to anyone.
A couple of important details that got overlooked.
Don Jr. and Eric Trump do not have to put up the $5 million each that they were fined. Those collections are being paused as well.
The restrictions against Don Jr. and Eric Trump that would prevent them from running the business for 3 years has been lifted.
So much for that accountability. Can’t wait to hear about the entire judgement getting tossed because an appelate judge decided that the Susan Collins rule of “He learned his lesson, and he pinky swears it won’t happen again” applies.
It’s fucking ridiculous. Anyone else would be in prison by now. This guy just gets to run out the clock because everyone in the justice system is too afraid to look biased.
Districts have to beef up security when the DA makes a press briefing. Judges are receiving hundreds of death threats and have to hire their own security. Law clerks and random employees being dragged into it and threatened because trump thinks they’re an easy target. Random low level officials having their lives ruined because they were randomly targeted. This is the life of trying to hold trump to account. Government officials admitting being unwilling to vote, speak out, or take action against him out of credible threats of retribution from lone wolf meth heads.
Given the political powder keg this country is currently in, it’s not surprising that there are few judges out there willing to pull the trigger and risk having to go into hiding for their own safety versus just giving him what he wants and washing their hands of the whole thing, which seems to be the current game plan for most judges.
I thought this is the exact reason why we keep outfitting SWAT guys with army surplus gear? Isn’t that so we can defend the country against terrorists and other violent criminals? So all that is actually exclusively for murdering unarmed people and throwing flashbang grenades in infants’ cribs, got it.
Yeah, I agree. But saying that it happened over the course of decades kinda misses the scope of the problem by a bit.
The ability to have powerful, unaccountable people, in or outside of government that is the problem. It’s allowing these hierarchies to exist in the first place that’s the problem, and is it not the same source of the problem we had with the divine right of kings?
ONCE AGAIN, Donald Trump is treated with the kid gloves by the courts. Inconceivable. On the day the judgement was to be collected, Trump gets an absolute boon from the heavens above with a 10 day extension and a bond requirement of less than half of the original sum? For what reason? Trump defrauded the American people. He does not deserve special treatment.
Well, he did say that there is a two tiered justice system. Here is the proof that there is. I challenge any MAGA believer to attempt HALF what this guy has done and see if they get the same treatment as him. Go on, I’ll wait
Well sure we have millions who actually voted for a dehydrated mango who tried to overthrow the government to become God emperor. Many of whom still support him afterwards. Trust me I get it.
Well, it is the third most populated country. Out of 340 million people I imagine there’s quite a few you would absolutely hate and quite a few that you’d be great friends with.
My optimistic side believes this is the courts humiliating him by publicly demonstrating that he is not an actual billionaire. They’re aware that he has no ability to pay half a billion, and they want as much as they can actually get from him.
Oh no, that would just open up a whole huge can of worms.
If he goes, then it would be bad if there’s even a whiff of it being murder or assassination. As it is when he dies there’s going to be conspiracy nuts that will declare it an assassination no matter what.
The question is how many people would be receptive to a conspiracy theory.
There are some that will see, in person, an earthquake collapse buildings including one that kills Trump and assume the earthquake was made to assassinate him, but not too many folks would bite.
If he gets taken out by a “lone gunman”, then a lot of people are going to assume conspiracy.
Given his lifestyle, age, and physique, the most likely seems to be some cardiac event which will still be bad because some folks will scream “poison”.
Best case is that the voters reject a still-living Trump, and weather the least bad of the likely unfounded conspiracy theories.
He’s going to take every single Republican controlled state in the general. They’ll just announce that he won despite what the polls say and if it gets to SCOTUS they’ll pull another Bush v. Gore.
MLK was murdered by conservatives. He tried peaceful resistance before admitting it was ineffective. Peaceful resistance famously did not work. It’s amazing to me that you would try to cite this notorious failure of peaceful resistance as some kind of success story. It honestly just comes off racist with today’s conservative rhetoric that racism no longer exists.
Indian Independence from Britain…
Again, Ghandi was murdered by conservatives. Indefinite detentions were enacted and countless Indians were tortured to death by conservatives. Peace did not work in gaining independence from Britain. Unending mass-resistance that caused the deaths of many innocent Indians led to it just not being worth it for Britain.
Singing Revolution in the Baltics…
Only Estonia earned independence through peaceful protest. And that was due to a great deal of support by western nations, and a lack of trying to stop it by the Soviets. Estonia was not being actively oppressed, they just wanted independence. But when Latvia and Lithuania tried the same approach, violence WAS necessary in the form of riots, and deadly barricades. Numerous unarmed citizens of both countries were killed in violent resistance that eventually led to agreements for their independence. And again, the Soviets were barely motivated to stop it. Active conservative oppression was not a motivating factor here for these countries. Simple independence to pursue their own prosperity was the goal.
Arab Spring…
Really? Really?! This is an absurdity on its face. Innocent people are being oppressed by conservatives in the middle east in record numbers today and no one on earth thinks any differently. Why would you even try this one? The brief victories earned during the Arab Spring were earned through well-documented bloodshed and violent resistance.
I also predict he will COMPLAIN about this gift on truth social, saying they should have reduced it to Zero. Spitting right in the faces of those judges that just gave him the gift.
Honestly, considering he stated on Truth Social that he had 500M on hand, which he was absolutely NOT going to pay his bond with, I would’ve denied his appeal on that alone.
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